Both are good but still DB play better than CoF

Haha, lol'd at this one.
I still like both bands a great deal, but it is true: true sellouts!

Written by xplanet2112 on 07.03.2010 at 00:46

I don't know much about Cradle of Filth these days or anything of the other band. So forgive me if any of this is not new infomation!

Cradle of Filth started out as a deathmetal band that were looking for a gimmick to get noticed, the other way you could look at it was that they were trying to do something different to stand out from the crowd. As far as I know, people who I knew in bands that played shows with them before they were signed said that they used to wear masks such as Clown masks then all of a sudden, let's just say around the time of the aftermath of a curtain church burning and stabbing, COF started to wear the corpse paint!

I spoke to a Paul A just after the release of POEMF and it seemed to me that they were a very savy and professional band who were; looking for deals that would ensure their debut release would be available in major chain stores such as HMV and OurPrice; and that they went for a good production and mix of POEMF so not to put buyers off their music. He was a nice guy and very open about their plans for world domination. I remember at the time there were loads and loads of flyers for POEMF in the tape trading scene and just about everybody was telling me to buy it to support them.

I though CoF's debut it was a nice melodic power/death metal album with a few scattered black metal influences and enjoyed the ambient touches, but I never, ever, thought of them as a true black metal band because a) they were trying to gain commercial success through business relationships ie T-shirts, Cds been made available in chain stores. b) they recorded a melodic album with a good sound/mix production.

alrighty, then. what about Dimmu? does anybody know why exactly they're called sellouts all the time? is it because of them trying to get noticed by major labels/get their videos on mtv, etc? cause their music is so easy to listen to? because of the symphonic elements to their stuff? that wouldn't make much sense to me, since a ton of black metal bands use symphonic instruments in their music. i mean, even Emperor does it, for fuck's sake. can anybody shed some light on this for me?

First of all, the whole concept of "selling out" is pretty loaded. Often, bands who dabble in genres besides the one they started out in are called "sell-outs." I think that if a band really made music just for money, it couldn't possibly be good. However, Dimmu Borgir have been making amazing music ever since they shifted their style. I haven't heard much of CoF but I've heard enough to say that I can't get past the vocals. I wouldn't call CoF sell-outs either though.

Since ICS Vortex isn't more part of DB it is and always was Cradle of Filth, the band which converted me into a metalhead with their video Cradle to Enslave. Their last album is way superior to DBs.

I don't particularly care about "selling out" when it comes to (ex)black metal bands, but it was truly striking to hear zaero, ZERO good riffs and guitar arrangements on the last two of Dimmu Borgir's records. That was just torture, honestly, having to listen through it all. And the horrendous use of the orchestra (NOT that there is anything wrong with that per se, but the way thoe parts where incorporated into the songs is just godawful).
And that comes from a guy who actually likes all of the Dimmu Borgir catalogue up to In Sorte Diaboli (DCA was half fun, with some obvious filler material).

Now, Cradle of Filth are another story, yet again, a band that I like, but also a band that can still write fucking riffs, compelling and fun to listen to.
Obviously, I prefer CoF over Borgir.

Dimmu Borgir

CoF ftw \m/

Dimmu Borgir is pretty damn good, I can't seem to get into Cradle of Filth though

If it's new material, I'll take Dimmu Borgir over Cradle Of Filth. However, Cradle Of Filth's first couple albums are far superior to Dimmu Borgir's first offerings in my opinion. For the sake of the vote, I'll go with Dimmu Borgir for consistency though.

I personally like Dimmu Borgir's stuff a lot more than Cradle of Filth's material. And Dimmu used to be "all black metal" with keyboards back when they first started with For All Tid (which is indeed my favorite by them).

Dimmu Borgir are my favourite sell-out in metal.

I'd like to point out, and forgive me for being a technical smart ass, but Cradle switched from BM to Extreme Metal. DM went to Symphonic Black Metal, that is still in the same broad genre of BM.

Written by Ekim Reklaw on 01.12.2012 at 06:05

I'd like to point out, and forgive me for being a technical smart ass, but Cradle switched from BM to Extreme Metal. DM went to Symphonic Black Metal, that is still in the same broad genre of BM.

for your smartass comment you deserve a smartass correction
extreme metal is not a genre, but a collection of genres that includes death, black, extreme doom and by some definitions also thrash
cradle may or may not be still called extreme metal
the point about dimmu being symphonic black is debatable, their latest releases are not necessarily black, but certainly symphonic

Dimmu Borgir is definitely my favorite of these two sellouts. That really isn't saying much though since I don't really care for either, but Dimmu at least has their early albums like For All Tid, which is a really awesome album.

Written by theFIST on 27.12.2012 at 16:44

Written by Ekim Reklaw on 01.12.2012 at 06:05

I'd like to point out, and forgive me for being a technical smart ass, but Cradle switched from BM to Extreme Metal. DM went to Symphonic Black Metal, that is still in the same broad genre of BM.

for your smartass comment you deserve a smartass correction
extreme metal is not a genre, but a collection of genres that includes death, black, extreme doom and by some definitions also thrash
cradle may or may not be still called extreme metal
the point about dimmu being symphonic black is debatable, their latest releases are not necessarily black, but certainly symphonic

Time for you to simmer down fella. Perhaps some chill in the form of a pill will do. Dimmu Borgir was, is and will forever be black metal.

Cradle of filth was the band that introduced me to metal overall but dimmu's earlier stuff was what helped me get into black metal. I picked dimmu mainly because I still listen to a lot of their stuff.

Ive never liked cradle of filth, they kinda piss me off; I cant even see a picture of them without getting angry. Dimmu may be a sellout band, but at least they have talent (and brilliant symphonic arrangements). Old Dimmu is decent, and their 2000's stuff is hit and miss. I almost feel embarrassed to call either of these bands black metal, yeah they fit the "standard" sound of the genre, but they have NONE of the original spirit BM was based upon. (A rebellion against commercial death metal).

Dimmu Borgir. Have seen both Cradle of Filth and Dimmu Borgir live. Man, Cradle of Filth (sorry) actually sucked big time, man those vocals were friggin' annoying! Dimmu Borgir with a live orchestra was enjoyable though

I don't think either bands are sell-outs but my vote would go to Dimmu Borgir since I prefer them to Cradle Of Filth (although I enjoy both bands tremendously, actually). Dimmu Borgir's musical progression has been very steady and natural throughout their career which I think is evident from album-to-album - no drastic changes have ever been made and each album expands upon the previous release. Cradle Of Filth, at the height of their popularity, when Sony gave them a chance, released Damnation And A Day which is a very progressive, sprawling album that is the exact opposite of a band selling out and "dumbing down" their sound for mass public consumption. Just because an artist gets popular doesn't mean they sold out.

This is so difficult as they both suck so much
I would have to pick Dimmu Borgir because they at least had one good album (For All Tid). Every COF album is either generic, boring, or just straight up shit.

Written by squidrick420 on 21.01.2013 at 02:52

(A rebellion against commercial death metal).

Black metal's original spirit was a rebellion against organized religion, with a strong focus on anti-Christianity; had nothing to do with death metal at all (in fact death metal barely existed when black metal started and it certainly hadn't reached any form of commerciality). You are referring to the first wave of Norwegian black metal (which was actually the second wave of black metal overall) and they were anti-commercial death metal but their main idealogy and cause for gathering was still rebellion against religion/Christianity.

Written by psykometal on 13.02.2013 at 05:45

Written by squidrick420 on 21.01.2013 at 02:52

(A rebellion against commercial death metal).

Black metal's original spirit was a rebellion against organized religion, with a strong focus on anti-Christianity; had nothing to do with death metal at all (in fact death metal barely existed when black metal started and it certainly hadn't reached any form of commerciality). You are referring to the first wave of Norwegian black metal (which was actually the second wave of black metal overall) and they were anti-commercial death metal but their main idealogy and cause for gathering was still rebellion against religion/Christianity.

I was referring to the first wave of norwegian, believe me I have studied the history of first wave and second wave. However when i think of first wave bands like bulldozer, tormentor, vulcano, sadistik execution, and such; I don't see or hear them playing black metal as its own genre yet, it was more like a subgenre of thrash (some closer to the "BM" sound then others). I don't even consider the Norwegian scene to be in waves, everything there belongs to the second wave of BM to me (except possibly Mayhem's Deathcrush EP).

Dimmu Borgir: Real Symphonic Style (Symphonic Instrumental Spaces) from first album to last.
Cradle of Filth: Real Gothic Style from first album Not to last album.

I prefer Dimmu Borgir for Best Symphonic Spaces. i really Like these Spaces. it shows Good Tallent of Dimmu Borgir
but Cradle of filth have NO NEW Talent in last albums. but i like ancient albums.

i am waiting for Dimmu Borgir New Album

Good luck

Dimmu Borgir are certainly better. I never really liked Cradle Of Filth.

Written by Fallen Ghost on 27.01.2013 at 01:37

Dimmu Borgir. Have seen both Cradle of Filth and Dimmu Borgir live. Man, Cradle of Filth (sorry) actually sucked big time, man those vocals were friggin' annoying! Dimmu Borgir with a live orchestra was enjoyable though

In my opinion, the whole band is annoying.

Dimmu Borgir. I'll always have a soft spot for them. Their first three albums are so brilliantly somber and epic. I even like all the albums after that, even if there's a little more filler to go around. Except for Abrahadabra which I didn't like at all. It was way overblown, even by Dimmu's standards. Still, I respect them. They're one of the few symphonic bands I like. I was never big into Cradle though. The Principles of Evil Made Flesh is a good album but it's all downhill from there.

I don't consider either band to be a sellout. To even suggest that is really reaching. Every band needs to evolve, so long as it's a natural evolution. It really shouldn't matter if they aren't "true black metal."

Dimmu Borgir.

Made many great albums and only 1 or 2 that are a bit boring. But COF as much as I like some of their stuff, They released a bunch of very boring albums compared to Dimmu.

Written by DyingWorld on 26.07.2013 at 08:16

I don't consider either band to be a sellout. To even suggest that is really reaching. Every band needs to evolve, so long as it's a natural evolution. It really shouldn't matter if they aren't "true black metal."

Agree with this entirely. Screaming "sellout" is just something that diehard fanboys scream when their favorite bands have decided to evolve and write music that they no longer like.

Written by psykometal on 27.07.2013 at 02:27

Agree with this entirely. Screaming "sellout" is just something that diehard fanboys scream when their favorite bands have decided to evolve and write music that they no longer like.

YOU SING IT!