False Metal: What's your definition



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Original post

Posted by , 19.01.2012 - 05:27
I hear the term "False Metal" used every now and then to describe certain bands. I've heard everything from Slipknot to Daath called this. I would like to know how fellow Metal Storm users define false metal. And what are the requirements to be considered as such? What bands do you consider false metal?
23.02.2015 - 22:50
ADIresiduos
Written by Ganondox on 23.02.2015 at 08:33

Written by ADIresiduos on 20.02.2015 at 00:50

I guess false metal would be a wanna-be "metal" band..... Baby Metal anyone?

The rest are just sub-genres.

Mainstream is bad? of course not! this is how a lot more people will get to know metal and further expand the metal community.
I started with AC/DC (classic rock) many years ago and now I hear some death, prog, alt, metal, extreme, etc.


How is Baby Metal not metal? Sure, they're an idol group, but that doesn't make their music any less metal.


In this case I disagree; I read an interview they had with Babymetal and the girls mentioned that they didn't had a clue of what metal was; IMO they're maybe a pop rock kid band, but definately not metal... I can't imagine them opening for Megadeth.
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23.02.2015 - 23:44
Karlabos
Weirdo of MS
Written by ADIresiduos on 23.02.2015 at 22:50

I read an interview they had with Babymetal and the girls mentioned that they didn't had a clue of what metal was

That's hilarious.
Where can I read that?
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23.02.2015 - 23:58
BitterCOld
Gringo
Written by ADIresiduos on 23.02.2015 at 22:50


In this case I disagree; I read an interview they had with Babymetal and the girls mentioned that they didn't had a clue of what metal was; IMO they're maybe a pop rock kid band, but definately not metal... I can't imagine them opening for Megadeth.


true. considering GImme Chocolate has more balls than anything off Super Collider. and that's sad on many levels.
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24.02.2015 - 01:25
wrathchild
Written by Karlabos on 23.02.2015 at 23:44

Written by ADIresiduos on 23.02.2015 at 22:50

I read an interview they had with Babymetal and the girls mentioned that they didn't had a clue of what metal was

That's hilarious.
Where can I read that?


It's everywhere, text and video interviews.
They were 10 years old (that's young even by idols standards) when the band was created. I didn't have a clue what metal was at that age, started digging music at 14.
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La belleza no reside en lo que puedas crear, sino en lo que eres capaz de transmitir
Beauty resides not in what you're able to create, but in what you're able to communicate


Txus, Mägo De Oz
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24.02.2015 - 09:47
Ganondox
Written by ADIresiduos on 23.02.2015 at 22:50

Written by Ganondox on 23.02.2015 at 08:33

Written by ADIresiduos on 20.02.2015 at 00:50

I guess false metal would be a wanna-be "metal" band..... Baby Metal anyone?

The rest are just sub-genres.

Mainstream is bad? of course not! this is how a lot more people will get to know metal and further expand the metal community.
I started with AC/DC (classic rock) many years ago and now I hear some death, prog, alt, metal, extreme, etc.


How is Baby Metal not metal? Sure, they're an idol group, but that doesn't make their music any less metal.


In this case I disagree; I read an interview they had with Babymetal and the girls mentioned that they didn't had a clue of what metal was; IMO they're maybe a pop rock kid band, but definately not metal... I can't imagine them opening for Megadeth.


So? The attitude of the girls has no bearing on the music's genre. Their music is still clearly metal, they are just an idol group and thus incorporate general idol fakery.
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24.02.2015 - 17:00
ADIresiduos
Written by Ganondox on 24.02.2015 at 09:47

Written by ADIresiduos on 23.02.2015 at 22:50

Written by Ganondox on 23.02.2015 at 08:33

Written by ADIresiduos on 20.02.2015 at 00:50

I guess false metal would be a wanna-be "metal" band..... Baby Metal anyone?

The rest are just sub-genres.

Mainstream is bad? of course not! this is how a lot more people will get to know metal and further expand the metal community.
I started with AC/DC (classic rock) many years ago and now I hear some death, prog, alt, metal, extreme, etc.


How is Baby Metal not metal? Sure, they're an idol group, but that doesn't make their music any less metal.


In this case I disagree; I read an interview they had with Babymetal and the girls mentioned that they didn't had a clue of what metal was; IMO they're maybe a pop rock kid band, but definately not metal... I can't imagine them opening for Megadeth.


So? The attitude of the girls has no bearing on the music's genre. Their music is still clearly metal, they are just an idol group and thus incorporate general idol fakery.


I think you nailed it with your last phrase: idol fakery. Metal? is there a little kid metal sub-genre? ok, maybe they would fit in such sub-genre. Although it would be interesting to see them when they grow up and decide to do metal, in the vein of Kittie, In This Moment, Butcher Babies, Cripper, etc.
IMO, yes, attitude has a lot to do with metal. They say Black Sabbath started it all and their documentaries show what their attitude was back then when they were starting something new and unique.
Dee Snider mentioned in an interview that after the Stay Hungry record, and after selling millions of records of it, he was living the high life: cars, women, luxury... so then he started to have a hard time writing new stuff, good stuff, why? he had it all, he was not "hungry" or "angry" anymore... something was missing... attitude maybe?
I'm not saying that being rich is bad for metal bands, but they have to have the right attitude to be able to transmit metal / rock music to the listener.
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24.02.2015 - 17:38
Charly546
Written by ADIresiduos on 24.02.2015 at 17:00

I think you nailed it with your last phrase: idol fakery. Metal? is there a little kid metal sub-genre? ok, maybe they would fit in such sub-genre. Although it would be interesting to see them when they grow up and decide to do metal, in the vein of Kittie, In This Moment, Butcher Babies, Cripper, etc.
IMO, yes, attitude has a lot to do with metal. They say Black Sabbath started it all and their documentaries show what their attitude was back then when they were starting something new and unique.
Dee Snider mentioned in an interview that after the Stay Hungry record, and after selling millions of records of it, he was living the high life: cars, women, luxury... so then he started to have a hard time writing new stuff, good stuff, why? he had it all, he was not "hungry" or "angry" anymore... something was missing... attitude maybe?
I'm not saying that being rich is bad for metal bands, but they have to have the right attitude to be able to transmit metal / rock music to the listener.


So, what exactly is attitude in a music context and how does it translate into music? If you're really angry in the recording studio while while playing your instrument, does the recorded music also reflect that? With vocals it's quite simple usually - from the tone of the voice you can usually tell the emotions of the speaker/singer, but what about music itself? Does the guitarist play faster and drummer hits harder? Or let us put it in a different way which reflects the case of Babymetal better - if a guitarist plays an unknown (to the player) piece of music from a sheet which is the main riff of [some_well-known_and_irrefutably_metal_song], is he playing metal? If not, then what is he playing then? Hard rock? Country?

I do not really wish to discredit the existence of "inspiration" or "attitude", but maybe Dee Snider just didn't know what to write? Had a case of writers block? Went to the studio to, sat down with the guitar to compose and no good ideas (as in better than previous stuff) came to mind. Just like a writer after writing a best-selling novel.
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24.02.2015 - 18:21
ADIresiduos
Written by Charly546 on 24.02.2015 at 17:38

Written by ADIresiduos on 24.02.2015 at 17:00

I think you nailed it with your last phrase: idol fakery. Metal? is there a little kid metal sub-genre? ok, maybe they would fit in such sub-genre. Although it would be interesting to see them when they grow up and decide to do metal, in the vein of Kittie, In This Moment, Butcher Babies, Cripper, etc.
IMO, yes, attitude has a lot to do with metal. They say Black Sabbath started it all and their documentaries show what their attitude was back then when they were starting something new and unique.
Dee Snider mentioned in an interview that after the Stay Hungry record, and after selling millions of records of it, he was living the high life: cars, women, luxury... so then he started to have a hard time writing new stuff, good stuff, why? he had it all, he was not "hungry" or "angry" anymore... something was missing... attitude maybe?
I'm not saying that being rich is bad for metal bands, but they have to have the right attitude to be able to transmit metal / rock music to the listener.


So, what exactly is attitude in a music context and how does it translate into music? If you're really angry in the recording studio while while playing your instrument, does the recorded music also reflect that? With vocals it's quite simple usually - from the tone of the voice you can usually tell the emotions of the speaker/singer, but what about music itself? Does the guitarist play faster and drummer hits harder? Or let us put it in a different way which reflects the case of Babymetal better - if a guitarist plays an unknown (to the player) piece of music from a sheet which is the main riff of [some_well-known_and_irrefutably_metal_song], is he playing metal? If not, then what is he playing then? Hard rock? Country?

I do not really wish to discredit the existence of "inspiration" or "attitude", but maybe Dee Snider just didn't know what to write? Had a case of writers block? Went to the studio to, sat down with the guitar to compose and no good ideas (as in better than previous stuff) came to mind. Just like a writer after writing a best-selling novel.


I believe that in a certain way, recorded music does reflect the attitude of the musician. Just as an example, compare Stairway To Heaven (Zeppelin) vs Angel Of Death (Slayer). The first one is kind of soothing and emotional rock music and the 2nd is total mayhem. Each of them (musicians) had to be in a certain mood or had a certain attitude to be able to write and perform the way they did, and thus be able to transmit it through their recordings.
I know that mood and the attitude are intangible things, but are indeed present when we transmit a message, be it spoken, music, written, etc.
I myself am a guitar player and vocalist (mostly rock / metal), been in metal bands and have written original music / songs; at least for me, mood and attitude are present when writting music. You do have a point about writers block, because sometimes one is just not in the mood or inspired enough to create something.
When a session musician plays based on a music sheet, let's say a metal riff, mood and attitude have to be at par with what their playing, if not, then there are chances that the final cut will sound flat, uninspired, boring, even if it's stil a metal riff.
Maybe the guitar player from Babymetal does feel the metal music and thus performs very well, but when combined with the little girls voices... well.... it just doesn't cut it for me.
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24.02.2015 - 18:53
Ilham
Giant robot
All that talk is cute, but it doesn't make Babymetal any less metal. It's crap, sure, but no big words needed.

There is no "false metal". </thread>
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25.02.2015 - 00:31
ADIresiduos
Written by Ilham on 24.02.2015 at 18:53

All that talk is cute, but it doesn't make Babymetal any less metal. It's crap, sure, but no big words needed.

There is no "false metal". </thread>


I guess you're right: metal is metal, good or bad, as long as it sounds like metal or at least a hint of metal.
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25.02.2015 - 00:52
Ilham
Giant robot
Written by ADIresiduos on 25.02.2015 at 00:00

I guess you're right: metal is metal, good or bad, as long as it sounds like metal or at least a hint of metal.

You said it better than I did. ;-)
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28.02.2015 - 13:32
Bad English
Masterchief
Manowar --- false metal, well metal is metal, what make it its guitar sound, instrument sound , many genres subgenres, of course posers are everywhere, but all depends of taste, you can feel what is good and bad. if you like , don't like
what describe genre is guitar sound, nothing more ... so Venom is speed, thrash metal, Saxon will not be black metal if they will have satanistic lyrics
Immortal is black metal, not Nordic or cold metal (as Xronos wants)
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Stormtroopers of Death - ''Speak English or Die''

I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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05.03.2015 - 14:50
Jtbmetal123
It has to be heavy.
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28.10.2015 - 20:04
Cavernous
This is the same kind of discussions they must have at ISIS' meetings or something.
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16.11.2015 - 19:42
IntestinalCrypt
The most important criteria would be:

1) Most of the songs are not written by any member of the band, but rather by some hired (star-)producer.
2) The music is engineered to take advantage of current trends (in either music and/or fashion) in such a way as to achieve maximum commercial success in as short time as possible. (Note: not the same thing as being mainstream or commercially successful, just cynically manufactured for that purpose alone)
3) The singer sounds too whiny but does not sing about dragons.
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19.11.2015 - 23:52
Guib
Thrash Talker
-_- Alright, just face it... It's not because you don't like a Metal band that it's not metal. You can have Fake Idolatry all over the place, who cares... if there's heavy twin guitars shreddin' riffs, loud drums pummelin' and a bass in the back.. no matter if it's 3 asian schoolgirls fronting that, it's most likely metal. The attitude, trend or the gimmick behind it simply do not describe metal music, why? I just fuckin' said it.. it's music, it's all about sound. Why are we even arguing this... Isn't it fucking obvious to everyone? Don't be too butt hurt because some band turn your ''Oh so precious'' metal world into a Japanese freak-show once in a while...
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- I love my technical, melodic, my thrash, agressive and fast paced, my sludge, well thought, my heavy, heavier and my metal, ever-growing -
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30.11.2015 - 21:57
BitterCOld
Gringo
Written by Cavernous on 28.10.2015 at 20:04

This is the same kind of discussions they must have at ISIS' meetings or something.



... before shouting DeMaioHu AKbar and lopping off the heads of heretics and blasphemers. With Power.

and welcome back.
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get the fuck off my lawn.
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30.11.2015 - 22:38
mz
Every metal record I do not like is false metal.
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Giving my ears a rest from music.
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30.11.2015 - 22:48
Karlabos
Weirdo of MS
"false metal" seems like a chemistry definition for certain elements or something
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2016

2017
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30.11.2015 - 23:25
Maco
Handbanana
Metal fiction.
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I'm derp.
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