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Why Should the British be Tolerant of Muslims when...



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24.12.2006 - 01:09
-tom-
Mr FancyPants
over half a million christians have been forced out of iraq due to constant attacks from the muslim community?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6205299.stm
http://www.itv.com/news/index_ee6873d59b6681fac645742c451cdd2a.html

Quote:
Dr Rowan Williams,
Archbishop of Canterbury

"What we have seen in the last year or so in Iraq has been attacks on Christian priests, the murder of some Christian priests, and the massive departure of large numbers of Christians from Iraq,"



what happens if you don't follow the right religion in a mainly islamic country? violent attacks, church burnings (*black metal joke here*), murders etc.

the iraq war has instigated this to some degree but its clear that islam is not a tolerant religion and yet the islamic population in england grows constantly. Should we not be slightly worried about the large, ever-growing muslim community in england when this is what is happening to non-muslims in iraq? or how about when worldwide riots happen involving violence and death threats because of a cartoon in a newspaper?

in addition to this, many muslims don't appear to want to be part of english society. An increasing amount of people living in england do not speak english and do not leave their community at all so have no contact with the british people.

The british government needs to actually take some action against the people that aren't willing to integrate into society and having signposts in both english and arabic isn't the solution. it only seperates the two communities more. Look at how long Abu Hamza was allowed to make speeches encouraging intolerance, hatred and even violence towards british people. even when they decided that racially motivated violence was bad (ORLY?), he only received a seven year sentence


Over half a million christians have been drove out of iraq by an intolerant and violent islamic community. The islamic community in Britain grows constantly and parts of it are becoming completly seperated from the british community. What more needs to be said?
----
"This rudderless world is not shaped my metaphysical forces. It is not God who kills the children. Not fate that butchers them or destiny that feeds them to the dogs. It's us. Only us"

Read Watchmen.
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25.12.2006 - 00:41
Torelli

What you need to here is to seperate the people from the religion. Every religion can turn violent if it's interpretet wrongly. We have seen examples of militant christians, muslims, hinduists and even buddists. If you take a look at those countries were muslim immigrants come from you see that it often is from a country of dictorship, ruled by religious fanatics. This is effecting the population and makes the youth more hostile to westerns and that leads to misstrust and hate against arabs here in the west..It's an evil circle.
But what's need to be done is to bring up the tolerant muslims and change the negative veiw many have of muslims today, as well try to change the negative picture many people in middle east have. Without an open dialogue we soon have a third world war at hand...
To change the middle east view of us, the fanatical ones have to lose the influence over the people. To do that the countries need to be build up so that the people can live in good standards. If you live well(food,water, job security etc.), you can focus more on education and in that way increase the knowledge and perhaps over time even get unpartial news...

Regarding the more radical muslims in England(and Sweden), it should be more clear that if you don't follow th laws in the country, you're out. I find it hard to belive that you actually can promote hate and not be punished for it.
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25.12.2006 - 02:19
Arian Totalis
The Philosopher
With any religion, you will always have those from a fundamentalist or an extremist sect. True enough, it is wrong what these people are doing, but you should not condenm an entire religion and it's followers due to the actions of a particular extremist sect.
----
"For the Coward there is no Life
For the hero there is No Death"
-Kakita Toshimoko

"The Philosopher, you know so much about nothing at all." _Chuck Schuldiner.
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25.12.2006 - 13:43
-tom-
Mr FancyPants
i don't havea problem with all muslims. in fact,. i had islamic friends when i was at college but the british community and the british-muslim community are gradually seperating. We aren't doing anything to stop this. we're actually going out of our way to allow people to come to this country and not integrate at all. there are area's where arabic is the first language and many people don't even speak english at all. nor do they want to learn to. and why should they? it's of no advantage to them now that school's are happy to teach seperate classes for muslims.

This shouldn't be happening. The answer to the problem isn't to bend over backwards to accomodate people who don't like this country and don't like it's culture. We need to do everything we can to encourage immigrants to fit in with british society and deport the one's that cause a problem.

It's true that extremists are responsible for terrorism and violence. By allowing an islamic community to grow in britain seperate from british society, we are causing people to become extremists. It's an understatement to say that there is hostility between muslims and the british people.

i'm sure the majority of people agree with me that Abu Hamza shouldn't have been allowed to give speeches encouraging hatred and even violence towards the english people. yet little was done to stop him and despite his numerous crimes he's only serving seven years. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Hamza_al-Masri

Written by Torelli on 25.12.2006 at 00:41

What you need to here is to seperate the people from the religion. Every religion can turn violent if it's interpretet wrongly. We have seen examples of militant christians, muslims, hinduists and even buddists.


true. but islam is the only religion in this day and age which has a large number of followers that condone violence.

Quote:
According to a POPULUS survey from December 2005, Muslims in Britain oppose his [Abu Hamza] views by a factor of two-to-one; however, among the age group 18-24, the figures are reversed, and two out of three who expressed an opinion agree with his views (27% supporting his views, 14% disagreeing with them).


there are religious fanatics for all religions. However, we're not talking about one or two lone fanatics here. It;s rather distrubing that i regularly see muslim teenagers wearing hoodies with the image of 2 machineguns and the words 'defenders of the faith' (i can't seem to find any info on this on google so if you don't want to take my word for it then fair enough)

Written by Torelli on 25.12.2006 at 00:41

Regarding the more radical muslims in England(and Sweden), it should be more clear that if you don't follow th laws in the country, you're out. I find it hard to belive that you actually can promote hate and not be punished for it.


you can be punished for it if you're British National Party leader, Nick Griffin. i totally agree that he should have been prosecuted but he was only caught on film whining about immigrants once. Abu Hamza was filmed and photographed by the press for some time (and he was preaching on the streets of london wheras nick griffin was only talking to about thirty people at a BNP meeting).

Written by Torelli on 25.12.2006 at 00:41

But what's need to be done is to bring up the tolerant muslims and change the negative veiw many have of muslims today


This is something i'm unsure about. the british people generally are tolerant of muslims. Perhaps too tolerant seeing as many people don't seem to care that the muslim community in opposition to the british culture is ever-growing.
----
"This rudderless world is not shaped my metaphysical forces. It is not God who kills the children. Not fate that butchers them or destiny that feeds them to the dogs. It's us. Only us"

Read Watchmen.
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25.12.2006 - 16:01
Sunioj

Muslims killing christians and extradicting them, nothing new man, its been taking place in places like pakistan, palestine, egypt, indonesia, phillipinnes, sudan. The list goes on for eternity, ands its not just done to christians, its also towards those who are shiite ( if in a sunni majority ) or also done to druze. Thats why Israel has so much lebanese druze and christians, because they have been persecuted and ran away from places like that. One of my friends is a lebanese christian, and his village was pillaged causing his family to come to this country.

My own view on the causes. Lack of education and isolation from the rest of the world with the twist of clerics shariah allah running the community. And thats why you have situations like in Britain where the community is slowley seperating from the main causing isolation and lack of understanding of their envireonment. Im sure that Tommy tee would agree with me that Islamic law and mosques are also imposed on those communities as well. I have my own bias and hatred for Islam, ALIKE OTHER RELIGIONS, but the thing with Islam is that its not left to be interpreted by the individual, you have the clerics, the muftis, preaching their view and feel the obligation to be against western values at the same time.

Now, there are many nice muslims and I cant argue with that and I can say without hesitance most of them dont want to be in a state of jihad with the west, but once you are obligated with pride to one community, to be differrent and to oppose those views would meet in harsh reprisals like being disowned etc. Now you might think that why dont peaceful muslims do that? Thats because many muslims I know dont know where to start, they have lived their whole life based around Islamic society and feel such guilt to be differrent. ( keep in mind that this from the muslims I know )
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09.04.2007 - 08:35
Paganblood
The Aryaputra
I've no sympathy for the persecution of christians there because the christians oppressed and persecuted people holding different beliefs for past 1000-1500 years, but I don't support the persecution of christians by muslims either.
Quote:

Over half a million christians have been drove out of iraq by an intolerant and violent islamic community. The islamic community in Britain grows constantly and parts of it are becoming completly seperated from the british community.

That's bad. Yes, why should the british government be unneccessarily tolerant?(although I'm not british) I can imagine how one feels when his land suffers from foreign infiltrations... Its better to prevent any bad consequences(divisions? religious disharmony and clashes?) that might be brought about by this muslim infiltration.
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that which shines without names and forms...
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09.04.2007 - 17:27
EddieGunner
Valkoinen kuolem
Written by Arian Totalis on 25.12.2006 at 02:19

With any religion, you will always have those from a fundamentalist or an extremist sect. True enough, it is wrong what these people are doing, but you should not condenm an entire religion and it's followers due to the actions of a particular extremist sect.

----
On pirun vaikea selvitä hengissä hautaan saakka
It is damn difficult to stay alive till the grave
Erno Paasilinna
:devil:
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14.04.2007 - 17:46
Revenant
Account deleted
If you stoop to their level you're as bad as them, teahc by higher example.
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14.04.2007 - 19:37
Illusionist
Account deleted
Written by Arian Totalis on 25.12.2006 at 02:19

With any religion, you will always have those from a fundamentalist or an extremist sect. True enough, it is wrong what these people are doing, but you should not condenm an entire religion and it's followers due to the actions of a particular extremist sect.


I could not agree more. When people talk about Muslims, 9 times out of 10 they should have said Muslim Extremist.
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14.04.2007 - 20:49
Torelli

@Tommy tee: Sorry for a late reply, but I just want to point out that I ment both people like Nick Griffin and people like Abu Hamza when it comes to stricter rules. Preaching hate, whatever if it's targeted against arabs or westerness, should never be tolerated or encuraged.
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21.05.2007 - 08:41
ToCSiN
Account deleted
I just want to point one thing, not all Muslims are Arabs and your fingers are not all the same.
Even though i still agree with you man, it has became an issue and you can touch it's effects directly on the British community, in the same time all religions are about mercy and stuff like that, so those who are kicking Christian people out of their countries they don't even belong to Islam man.
I'm Syrian and 45% of the Syrian population is Christian, and they have been there for ages and forever will be.
I have nothing against Iraqi people, but am just against their policy.
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