...and here it is

With much pontificating on whether to even start this one, (due to the anticipation of a major headache), I present to you the official thread of the 2008 U.S. Presidential election. I am just too damn interested in seeing what everyone (U.S. and non-U.S. citizens alike) thinks. I would like for all of us to approach this in an atypical matter. DO NOT discuss petty issues that are discussed every day by various media outlets. (Abortion, Same-Sex Marriage, Etc.) Such issues have been presented to us with intent to take our minds off of things that are actually important.

Feel free to grace us with your opinions of the Political Candidates, Political Debates, Important Issues such as solutions for Iraq, The role that the U.S. will play in the world, Etc. Try also not to look only 4 years into the future...that is what has gotten the U.S. into so much trouble in the past...

Go 'lite' on posting or quoting tons of links to other sights. Everything should come from yourself...and please keep the personal insults to a minimum...we all (hopefully) have the same goal to make the world a better place. Unfortunately that peace is currently being halted by greedy politicians. Remember to keep the big question in mind: What political figure would be the best for the entire Global community and why? Go at it fools!

I think it's time for Bushy to sod off....better Hillary than him....or Al Gore....don't know much of it but whoever stops US from becoming more and more aggressive and greedy should dethrone the current "great leader"...period

Written by Ernis on 13.08.2007 at 22:55

I think it's time for Bushy to sod off....better Hillary than him....or Al Gore....don't know much of it but whoever stops US from becoming more and more aggressive and greedy should dethrone the current "great leader"...period

Bush is out of office no matter what, since he CAN'T be re-elected again. A US president can only sit for two terms.

So you want Al Gore? Remember who his wife is... yes, her of the PMRC. So Al will be bad for metal I think.

Written by Ernis on 13.08.2007 at 22:55

I think it's time for Bushy to sod off....better Hillary than him....or Al Gore....don't know much of it but whoever stops US from becoming more and more aggressive and greedy should dethrone the current "great leader"...period

Busch is out anyway he cant be president more how 2 times

From what I've seen (including several interviews on The Late Show with David Letterman ) I reckon Obama would be a good choice. I don't think he's doing too well in the polls though
One of the most relevant things to me - actually maybe not since I'm not in America, but... - is the issue of video game legislation. So far Clinton is going down the wrong road... and I don't think I'd ever back a Republican. I would quite like to see what would happen with a woman or a black guy in charge, but overall I just think Obama seems like a good guy with good priorities.

yes I think Obama would be a good choice,whatever I think republicans must get a nice proper defeat because i keep hearing wonders from them, not to mention dissordered Bush

Wow, this forum is still going?

Hm, well, I would cast my vote for Mitt Romney. His father did an excellent job as governor.

I don't think anything will change so much.U.S has a stationary politics about issues and their approach don't change much.So names are unimportant i don't think the future president will have ideas which are too much better than bushs'

i agree 100% with darksun, USA isnt known for been a liberal country, even if Al Gore wins, they arent going to sign the Kyoto Protocol or change theis migration politics, even i dare to say that the new president isnt going to retreat the troops from irak.

@Darksun and Fhuesc: Sorry that you guys are so bitter, lots of country's around the world hate us, and not without good reason. Even in our history classes, we are taught that since the spanish-american war the US has been imperializing other country's. But hey, remember, we are a young nation, and we will with time, change. Lots of other country's are guilty of crimes we are committing now, the rest of the world isn't innocent.

As for my own personal views on this, hmm....well I have been under conservative rule for over eight years of my life, that is since I have been ten years old. Needless to say, I am ready for some change. I will be able to vote in this next election, and one thing is for certain, I am not voting conservative. I don't associate myself with any one political party, to me that would only be restricting myself, and besides, both are corrupt as hell. Even though I want a liberal in office though, I definitly do NOT want Hillary Clinton there. It's not the fact that she's a woman though, it's her anti-video game, closed minded, anti-gun (I believe in my second amendment) viewpoints. Obama seems to be pretty even on these issues, you know, more open minded. So yeah....my hopes definitly ride with Obama.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 14.08.2007 at 14:27

Written by Ernis on 13.08.2007 at 22:55

I think it's time for Bushy to sod off....better Hillary than him....or Al Gore....don't know much of it but whoever stops US from becoming more and more aggressive and greedy should dethrone the current "great leader"...period

So you want Al Gore? Remember who his wife is... yes, her of the PMRC. So Al will be bad for metal I think.

Same with Hillary...

Oh, and I don't think that Al Gore is running for President anyways. haha it's so funny....like I remember when it was Bush vs Gore and I was one of the few people who hated Bush. I remind certain people of that every day.

As for who I want to win....I can't really decide. Obama seems to be the popular choice right now, even though he is second in the Democratic race. Obama is very inexperienced though. Believe it or not, I wouldn't mind it if Ralph Nader somehow managed to pull it off, even though it is not going to happen. The Green Party is laughed upon for some reason in the US, and when you ask people why, they can't give you an intelligent response. Ralph Nader actually has way way way more fucking experience than anyone else in the race, and most of his policies seem more down to earth than other candidates...

I'm still undecided though. As long as Hillary Clinton and John McCain lose, I will be happy. haha McCain has no chance really...especially after John Stewart fucking pwnified his ass on TV.

Is that the guy who keeps answering questions right after saying them aloud? He doesn't seem too bad to me haha

The Greens aren't held with much confidence over here either, even though I think they have some good ideas. I've never understood the whole "conservative" "liberal" "socialist" deal and to be honest I can't be fucked learning about it. But Arian's definitely right about everyone having their flaws.

Oh yeah something I wanted to add a few days after first posting -
A week or two ago I was looking around wikipedia at a few various candidates and noticed all the ones I saw had something listed for Religion or whatever. And I know there's a Mormon or two running, so I'm wondering... are there any atheist candidates? Separation of church and state is IMO one of the most important things to achieve but everyone I've seen seems to be a Christian (and if you know me, then you know me )

wow, need to choose between two evils, and try to vote for less evil.. don't care who will win, although it will effect my life probably more than most of Americans. It is good bush can't be president again, but I doubt that it will have much influence of policy of his party, he was puppet anyway.

@:Arian Totalis: as you said yo are to young to remember, but who ever had won, the things are always the same, and let remind you of inform you that US as long list of countries, doesnt have a left wing in politics, so when you are saying "a more liberal goverment", you are refering to a not so righty goverment. If you dont believe me, check your history classes and youll see that im not 100% wrong.

Written by Syk on 17.08.2007 at 05:02

Oh yeah something I wanted to add a few days after first posting -
A week or two ago I was looking around wikipedia at a few various candidates and noticed all the ones I saw had something listed for Religion or whatever. And I know there's a Mormon or two running, so I'm wondering... are there any atheist candidates? Separation of church and state is IMO one of the most important things to achieve but everyone I've seen seems to be a Christian.

lol...you make it seem like the Mormon religion is obscure. It's actually very big over here. But anyways, I'm pretty sure that there aren't any legitimate Atheist candidates. There's probably a few "running", but hell, Mickey Mouse had some votes during the last election. Anyone that wants to run can write in their name in the ballot if they want.

In US history, if I'm not mistaken, every single President has been Christian. Kennedy was the only Catholic President, but that's still Christian, so...

Hah, i want Bowles to win. Sorry, yes, i am a national socialist - but it is a political view.
Hillary Clinton is a commy. Al Gore.. hmm.. better than Hillary or Bush, so he has my vote. Let's see what happens

Written by Guest on 18.08.2007 at 02:49

Hah, i want Bowles to win. Sorry, yes, i am a national socialist - but it is a political view.
Hillary Clinton is a commy. Al Gore.. hmm.. better than Hillary or Bush, so he has my vote. Let's see what happens

Gore isn't running for President....yet.

Yeah guys Gore only ran in 2000, I don't anticipate he'll even jump in the race. Besides, we don't want him in office, he made vicious attacks against the metal community in the 1980's, good thing Dee Snider pwned him or our freedom of expression here in the US may be limited.
.....No, for any metalhead, Al Gore is a bad, bad, bad thing.

Written by Arian Totalis on 18.08.2007 at 07:46

Yeah guys Gore only ran in 2000, I don't anticipate he'll even jump in the race. Besides, we don't want him in office, he made vicious attacks against the metal community in the 1980's, good thing Dee Snider pwned him or our freedom of expression here in the US may be limited.
.....No, for any metalhead, Al Gore is a bad, bad, bad thing.

I agree you....you must fear Gore and his wife....be afraid....
Well I saw his documentary and I liked his nature preserving attitude and attacks against Bush...but yeh....nothing's perfect...
Hillary....she's better than Gore, right....

Well...I won't be the one voting anyway so I can just hope that imperialising of the world will be put to an end and that everyone can be granted an equally fine and peaceful life....(I know this sounds awfully mindless...)

Anyway....we need a similar thing happening in Russia as well...these two "sistahs" in the world should have less greedy and kinder leaders....

Written by Ernis on 19.08.2007 at 18:08

Written by Arian Totalis on 18.08.2007 at 07:46

Yeah guys Gore only ran in 2000, I don't anticipate he'll even jump in the race. Besides, we don't want him in office, he made vicious attacks against the metal community in the 1980's, good thing Dee Snider pwned him or our freedom of expression here in the US may be limited.
.....No, for any metalhead, Al Gore is a bad, bad, bad thing.

I agree you....you must fear Gore and his wife....be afraid....
Well I saw his documentary and I liked his nature preserving attitude and attacks against Bush...but yeh....nothing's perfect...
Hillary....she's better than Gore, right....

Doubtful....I could go on and on about how corrupt the Clintons are, but it's basically just gossip.

I personally really like Barak Obama right now. As far as everything I have seen and read from the debates, he seems the least likely to be bribed. One of the democratic candidates, Mike Gravel, who is actually a lot smarter and less crazy than he comes off, tried to call Obama out for taking a certain amount of money from a certain corporation. Obama responded with the fact that he was the one who wrote the law that was passed in the senate, that allowed people to see where the actual money came from. Obama also talks about unity. And not just immature, power-hungry-team up against Bush propi. that Hillary Clinton throws out there, but rather that the Democrats and Republicans need to unite and stop acting like children. He is not too experienced, but that hasn't mattered too much in the past. He is also black...which will play an interesting part even though it shouldn't.

Hillary Clinton is definitely the democratic favorite, IMO. I don't like anything she says, I don't like how indirect she is with answering (or neglecting to answer) questions. But the people love her. That is what scares me about America. They can't see through her complete bullshit. It's not about being against George W. Bush!!!!! It's about being against the people that are telling Bush to do what he has done! The political scale is too often taught on a linear scale. We often learn that far right is fascist and far left is communist. But who was worse...Stalin or Hitler. They were both bad. I like to relate the same thing (on a much lower scale) with Bush and Clinton. They may appear to be opposites of each other, but they are in fact just the faces of a darker force that is starting to get a real grasp on this country.....and the grasp will be tighter if the people vote for her.

As far as the Republicans go, I wouldn't say McCain is out. He has a very good chance of winning the primaries because he actually knows something about war strategy. I don't really know anything about Romney, other than the fact that he beat Kerry in a very Democratic state and has been well-liked since. Some typical things we hear about Romney are that he flip flops, and that he is Mormon...but as a member of the LDS church, I can tell you myself that the fact that he is "Mormon" means absolutely nothing. He could be good, he could be an asshole, but it doesn't really have anything to do with what church he goes to or what is beliefs are. The church is not seeking for any sort of political power I can tell you that.

Guilliani...I really don't know. I have no comment...I need to watch him more in the debates.

Some interesting questions...what the hell happened to Colin Powell? It would be awesome if he would come back, but I don't think he trusts our govt. anymore. Also, why couldn't a Democrat have a Republican Vice President or vice versa? Could Guiliani and Clinton really be working together in some scheme?

Last thing, if you were to be elected President, what would your Iraq strategy be? What will you look for in these candidates as far as Iraq goes?

Written by Konrad on 20.08.2007 at 14:41

Hillary Clinton is definitely the democratic favorite, IMO. I don't like anything she says, I don't like how indirect she is with answering (or neglecting to answer) questions. But the people love her. That is what scares me about America. They can't see through her complete bullshit. It's not about being against George W. Bush!!!!! It's about being against the people that are telling Bush to do what he has done! The political scale is too often taught on a linear scale. We often learn that far right is fascist and far left is communist. But who was worse...Stalin or Hitler. They were both bad. I like to relate the same thing (on a much lower scale) with Bush and Clinton. They may appear to be opposites of each other, but they are in fact just the faces of a darker force that is starting to get a real grasp on this country.....and the grasp will be tighter if the people vote for her.

As far as the Republicans go, I wouldn't say McCain is out. He has a very good chance of winning the primaries because he actually knows something about war strategy. I don't really know anything about Romney, other than the fact that he beat Kerry in a very Democratic state and has been well-liked since. Some typical things we hear about Romney are that he flip flops, and that he is Mormon...but as a member of the LDS church, I can tell you myself that the fact that he is "Mormon" means absolutely nothing. He could be good, he could be an asshole, but it doesn't really have anything to do with what church he goes to or what is beliefs are. The church is not seeking for any sort of political power I can tell you that.

Guilliani...I really don't know. I have no comment...I need to watch him more in the debates.

Some interesting questions...what the hell happened to Colin Powell? It would be awesome if he would come back, but I don't think he trusts our govt. anymore. Also, why couldn't a Democrat have a Republican Vice President or vice versa? Could Guiliani and Clinton really be working together in some scheme?

Last thing, if you were to be elected President, what would your Iraq strategy be? What will you look for in these candidates as far as Iraq goes?

Well, Hillary actually has an advantage I think because I'm willing to assume that most American women will blindly vote for her, even though she is a massive douche bag. And about Guilliani, uhm I don't know much about him either, but I know he sure likes to bring up 9/11 a lot, and that's really annoying for me. He'll probably get New York's vote, just because he likes to lay the terrorist disaster on thick.

Written by Dangerboner on 17.08.2007 at 05:48

Written by Syk on 17.08.2007 at 05:02

Oh yeah something I wanted to add a few days after first posting -
A week or two ago I was looking around wikipedia at a few various candidates and noticed all the ones I saw had something listed for Religion or whatever. And I know there's a Mormon or two running, so I'm wondering... are there any atheist candidates? Separation of church and state is IMO one of the most important things to achieve but everyone I've seen seems to be a Christian.

lol...you make it seem like the Mormon religion is obscure. It's actually very big over here. But anyways, I'm pretty sure that there aren't any legitimate Atheist candidates. There's probably a few "running", but hell, Mickey Mouse had some votes during the last election. Anyone that wants to run can write in their name in the ballot if they want.

In US history, if I'm not mistaken, every single President has been Christian. Kennedy was the only Catholic President, but that's still Christian, so...

I lived in Arizone for 4 years, which is FULL of Mormons. In fact, Mesa(a suburb of Phoenix) is basically "Little Utah". Mesa didn't want a sports arena in their town, any decent bus service(or ANY bus service at all on weekends), or business owners having signs in their windows, but they sure seem to love their sex offenders- it seemed like every day The Arizona Republic and The East Valley Tribune reported new sex offenders moving into town there. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if Michael Jackson ends up moving there someday!

As far as candidates go, I'm leaning toward either Obama or Ron Paul.

Written by Dangerboner on 24.08.2007 at 03:58

Written by Konrad on 20.08.2007 at 14:41

...some random nonsense that is too long to re-post...

Well, Hillary actually has an advantage I think because I'm willing to assume that most American women will blindly vote for her, even though she is a massive douche bag. And about Guilliani, uhm I don't know much about him either, but I know he sure likes to bring up 9/11 a lot, and that's really annoying for me. He'll probably get New York's vote, just because he likes to lay the terrorist disaster on thick.

I don't know man...every woman I know in America hates Hillary Clinton more than I do. Especially the old people. I really don't know anyone that really likes her come to think of it. I wonder if she really is as popular as the media is making her sound...after all Polls are kind of manipulated anyway. I think Guilliani would be the same type of President as Hillary actually...hell, they could be in this whole thing together. I will be very dissappointed if Guilliani ends up running against Clinton...I don't think I could vote for either of them...I mean look at this bullshit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_of_Rudy_Giuliani

Written by Konrad on 27.08.2007 at 13:33

Written by Dangerboner on 24.08.2007 at 03:58

Written by Konrad on 20.08.2007 at 14:41

...some random nonsense that is too long to re-post...

Well, Hillary actually has an advantage I think because I'm willing to assume that most American women will blindly vote for her, even though she is a massive douche bag. And about Guilliani, uhm I don't know much about him either, but I know he sure likes to bring up 9/11 a lot, and that's really annoying for me. He'll probably get New York's vote, just because he likes to lay the terrorist disaster on thick.

I don't know man...every woman I know in America hates Hillary Clinton more than I do. Especially the old people. I really don't know anyone that really likes her come to think of it. I wonder if she really is as popular as the media is making her sound...after all Polls are kind of manipulated anyway. I think Guilliani would be the same type of President as Hillary actually...hell, they could be in this whole thing together. I will be very dissappointed if Guilliani ends up running against Clinton...I don't think I could vote for either of them...I mean look at this bullshit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_of_Rudy_Giuliani

Yeah.....after reading that, I definitly don't want him in office.

@Arian Totalis: you are going to base your opinion on what wikipedia say?

Giuliani is a douchebag. I sincerely hope the American public can see through his strategy to ride the corpses of the 9/11 victims straight into the White House. It will be interesting to see if fear remains an effective tool of election in 2008.

Hillary is probably the most "Washingtonized" of all the democrats. For this reason (in addition to many others), I don't trust her. She would be an ineffective leader and just another stereotypical and corrupt politician with little understanding for the average slob.

Obama is probably the least corrupt of those that are running (at least in the upper tiers), and that can be attributed to his junior standing as a Senator. He is also the idealist of the bunch. This is appealing to many people, but I have to wonder how big his balls are when dealing with foreign policy. His ideals seem to get in the way with dealing with real world issues at times when cold hard decisions have to be made. This is slightly troubling to me at times, but Obama is a far more appealing choice than most of the other candidates.

Written by Fhuesc on 31.08.2007 at 08:01

@Arian Totalis: you are going to base your opinion on what wikipedia say?

I hate Guliani anyway, that just contributes to the effect.

Democrats:

Hilary is fighting her way up.....but honestly I don't think she will win.

first of all, half the people here fear her for many reasons that I'm not going to list. Second, she is a woman.
It might look like people are giving her support, but comes Election Day...just like the last election, people are going to jump ship. America is not ready for a female president; plus the republicans are screwing with the overall voting process which is going to diminish her votes even more.

Obama...well he has almost no political history. He spent 14 outside of the country and over all he's just a small farm boy trying to play in a political field. His main campaign features go around the whole "end the war" and "nationalized health care". Then he goes out and makes a war threat on Afghanistan? No thank You. Plus America is too broke for a nationalized health care system. He sounds like a 3rd grader running for class president with his campaign " and every Friday i will make the cafeteria lunch be PJ sandwiches and ice cream, and there will be Kool-Aid running from the water fountains instead of water" <--- Not going to happen. He's just there splitting the votes for the democrats. Plus, again, America is NOT ready for a minority to become a president.

Al Gore is not going to win, once you loose one election, your not going to win it ever again.....everyone else of the democratic party is pointless to talk about cause their support is just too weak


Republicans

Guliani is so far on top, he has the most money and support....I think he will win, not because the American public wants him, but because the democratic party is a mess and while hillary and obama are fighting it out, he will sneak in the back door. Most Americans that vote are surprisingly not that political. They don't know who they are voting for, they just know the name. And majority of America all they know is what a "good" job he did post 9/11. Plus so far, he's the most corrupt candidate on the list, so you KNOW he will find a way to climb on top.

Fred Thompson, well he's almost like the obama version of the Republican Party, people don't know much about him.



Personally I don't think it's a fight between the two parties anymore, I thinks it's just all a political ploy and the next president is already selected, the rest is just a show put on to make the American public think that they are still in control of their government.