I'd like to add something interesting in this convo, I personally am pacifist and hate guns, actually I've never even touched, not to mention held a real gun in my hands BUT I still don't believe blindly the theory "more guns, more crimes" and Finland is one exception in that.

Quote from Wikipedia:
"Although finns have third most firearms in the world per capita (right after United States and Yemen), totalling over 2 million registered privately owned firearms, gun related homicides are rare consisting only 14 percent of the total number of homicides."

you might think, well that's Finland, there's no crimes anyways but actually by world crime statistics Finland is is third in the world in total crimes per capita and has has the highest homicide rate per capita in Western Europe so it's funny that even we have so many guns they're not used in crimes like in the States for example.

As i mentioned already, I'm a pacifist, and I don't think we really need guns but then again we can't blame guns for violence in the world, we only can blame the people holding those guns.

If nobody had guns, the world would be a lot safer. I live near a pretty dangerous area and have seen people with AK-47's and even Rocket Launchers. Although I think it's impossible to control firearms (because some of these are illegal anyway) it would be nice to see less guns. If I had a gun, I'd probably be more tempted to use it. Therefore, I vote no.

no taka, that doesn't make sense in Finland, as i said, Finland has the highest rate of homicides per capita in the whole western europe so it's not about "not having much to do wrong". Here is what the statistics says homicides in Finland:

"Most victims and offenders are aged 40-49. A bit over quarter of victims and one out of ten offenders are women. In almost all cases where woman is the offender the victim is husband or other family member. In male offender cases 23 percent of the victims were strangers.
Less than 20 percent of the crimes are made outdoors. Half of the crimes involves men of marginalized group (unemployed, under educated, drug and alcohol problems) in heavy drinking situations where they end up in quarrel and stab or club each other to death.
One third of the homicides happens between family members, and then again lenghtened alcohol problems and low social status plays major catalyst in these situations. 60 percent of the male and 30 percent of the female homicide offenders have been arrested for drunken driving at least once."

Finland and Switzerland has pretty much same gun control, you need to have a licence to buy and own a gun, you can't carry gun in public places etc. BUT high number of firearms possesion also means that there are a lot of guns "in the market" illegal and legal ones, also you can pick one house out of three and be sure that there's a gun inside that house so getting an illegal/stolen gun is not really hard at least in Finland.. still we prefer knives and axes lol Anyways, i'm for a strict gun control, I just don't think it's so black and white.. like i said in my earlier post, more guns doesn't always mean more crimes.

Im against guns to a certain extent, I believe that a gun holds alot of responsibility in a good and bad way. The bad way would be if a person would have a history of violence or any mental disability should be allowed to have access to any weapons, however I know for a fact, civilians carrying guns in Israel are required to have that responsibility and are never given to anyone if the govt think it will result in violent acts.

During the first and second intifida, guns have helped protect mens families during terrorrist shooting sprees in civilian areas and alot of the time to neutralize suicide bombers about to carry out an attack. There has been a few sad instances where civilians used guns to committ hate crimes or other gang related politics, but thats a rare thing and plus, illegal weapons get around all the time on the black market.

Im not sure how easy it is to get a gun in America or Europe, but the govt has the responsibility of whether or not the wrong people get the gun. Thats how I feel.

Written by Konrad on 06.10.2006 at 18:01

If nobody had guns, the world would be a lot safer. I live near a pretty dangerous area and have seen people with AK-47's and even Rocket Launchers. Although I think it's impossible to control firearms (because some of these are illegal anyway) it would be nice to see less guns. If I had a gun, I'd probably be more tempted to use it. Therefore, I vote no.

Where the hell In the U.S. do you Live? I have yet to see a
guy run down the street with a rocketlauncher.

No, we do not need no firearms, would be better walking with swords and bows...
But, with the chaos that mankind created in the world, we need shitload of guns.

You have a point Jester Eddie, we have created a world where we need guns, we need them to hunt, we need them to protect our country, we need them to protect ourselves and our families.. or do we? I actually see in that a big problem, it's a cultural thing I guess, Finland has a high firearms possession but none of those guns are sold for protecting yourself, that's a no no here.

You need a licence for buying and possessing a gun and you need to explain why you need a gun, you could tell a lie and say that you want to hunt even you'd actually just want it for protection but would you be needing it so bad that you'd actually join a local hunting club, go thru shooting classes and tests before they accept you as a member.. if they're even accepting new members.. that's what it takes here, you need to prove that you need a gun for real and your licence will be cancelled in case you don't need the gun anymore or violate rules (for example part hunting club or aren't active member, commit a gun related crime or let someone who doesn't have a licence fire your gun) that way Finns doesn't even think about getting a gun just for protection.

If you're okay with the idea about shooting someone (even only to protect yourself or your family) you're not far away from doing it, I guess this way guns and shooting has become an okay thing in the US. Arian Totalis said that guns don't kill but people do, well if your society is full of people that could kill I really don't think it's a good idea to let them own and carry guns.

I agree with Angelique, it depends on the culture...

Written by Angelique on 06.10.2006 at 19:35

Arian Totalis said that guns don't kill but people do, well if your society is full of people that could kill I really don't think it's a good idea to let them own and carry guns.

Well, it's very simple, ANYONE could kill, even you. My society is not full of would be murderers, I feel safe where I am, I don't feel a threat by my suroundings. Do you think we can Just walk around with guns out on the street here? Sorry but we don't, only if it's being transported in a vehicle and in a locked case, with any amunition taken out of it, on the way to a hunting trip. You can't just decide who's close to killing or not, I think if you live in a Bad part of New York or L.A., than guns are necesarry to protect your loved ones, motherfuckers break into homes all the time lookin' to rob you out there, and the cops won't get there untill after it happens, so what are you gonna do? Well unless you wanna see your wife (and daughter) raped before your eyes and left in financial ruin, you probably better have a weapon, a firearm preferably, at hand.

Written by Arian Totalis on 06.10.2006 at 18:25

Written by Konrad on 06.10.2006 at 18:01

If nobody had guns, the world would be a lot safer. I live near a pretty dangerous area and have seen people with AK-47's and even Rocket Launchers. Although I think it's impossible to control firearms (because some of these are illegal anyway) it would be nice to see less guns. If I had a gun, I'd probably be more tempted to use it. Therefore, I vote no.

Where the hell In the U.S. do you Live? I have yet to see a
guy run down the street with a rocketlauncher.

Come visit West Palm Beach, Florida.

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/search/content/local_news/epaper/2006/09/02/s1c_Gangstas_0902.html

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/search/content/local_news/epaper/2006/09/07/c1b_wpbBudget_0907.html

"The project "Gangstas and Thugs" was shot in less than a year and shows not only fights, but also a night life that comes with heavy artillery." - First Coast News (Jacksonville)

We need them sad enough. They are the best way to protect ourselves but at the same time we need guns because others have guns, it is a damn hard question. Guns should never have been invented.

I am not a friend of guns and here in Austria, crimes committed with guns are pretty rare (maybe one a month, but there's robberies included where the offender doesn't use the gun), but there have been some cases where family members have been shot by accident - which I find is the biggest negative point in owning a gun: gun-loving people have their rifles at their hands as soon as they hear someone streaking around...and if it's just a family member getting something to eat or a cat outside, they get shot.
I can't say that I don't have any contact with guns because we own two of them although we don't have a licence...but: we got them from my grand-parents, so they are very old and haven't been fired for more than fifty years or so. When they were in use, they were used to kill the sick animals whenever my grandparents had a little farm because they couldn't afford a vet, but that was many years ago. I don't think they could have been fired because we don't have munition and they may be rusted..and they are safely locked up so that my brother doesn't even know we own them. nobody in my family would ever use a gun - even at gunpoint because it's against what we think is good.
I believe that guns should only be allowed to farmers, hunters and forest wardens, but all of them should have a licence and a shooting and psychology test every five years or so. People who collect rifles should have to make them disfunctional. Anyone who shoots for sports, should have to leave the guns at the shooting range to make the household safer.
I do believe that people who do have positive contact with guns (not that they see a musder and are disgusted by the use of guns) are more likely to use them against somebody or themselves because if you are really interested in it, I believe that getting guns illegally is not too difficult. I do also believe that if you have a gun that is loaded at home, you're more likely to die by being shot. But, as I said, guns are not so popular here...luckily.

Written by Arian Totalis on 06.10.2006 at 05:10

I feel that We should be allowed to own guns, and to a degree, we do need them. The way I see it, a weapon is a weapon, they're all capable of killing, and it simply depends on the person wielding it. So, that being said, I even believe people should be allowed to own fully automatic assult rifles. Now, I know what your thinking, "Arian you fucking hick, why the HELL do we need that!?!?!" Well, what if someone is a gun collector?, weather it be for historical, or simply apreciative value. Remember, guns don't kill people, people do. It simply depends on the responsibility of the user. If someone is Scitzophrinic, Of course they shouldn't have a Gun! But if they're just someone who wants to have it for the sake of collection, and they have been properly educated, then there isn't a problem. Now I know I'm gonna take some heat for this, so go ahead people, fire away, But quite frankly, I see nothing wrong with my beliefs.

If a person is a gun collector he might get a permission to have guns. That dosent mean all sould get ther fingers on full-automatic firearms as easy as bying anyhing else.

yearh guns dont kill people but people do. But atomic bombs dont kill poeple but the person who orderet it fired does?
But that does not mean that its ok that it is ok if every one could gets their hands on a-bombs. i wouldnt feel secure if evry maniac good get his hands on a full-automatic weapon as easy as in the USA

and think about all the acident with guns when kids and inocent people get killed.

Have you ever seen Bowlin for columbine?

I shall start with a quote first to add levity to your thinking....


"This year will go down in history, for the first time a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future."

Adolph Hitler (1935 Berlin Daily)

Now after reading this quote from this man, you feel guns are not necessary then no amount of reason shall change your mind.

A gun is a tool, nothing more nothing less. It is peoples mind that need to change.Whether man used a stick 2000 years ago, a sword 1000 years ago or a gun now, society will always have looters
who want what another has and will use "any means necessary".

Secondly, we here in the states have this document unrivaled in history called the "Constitution". It allows men to be self
preservant and protect ones self. Our military is for national defense only and cannot protect in a civil manner.
Police are there to be responders to crime, not a protector. They cannot be all places at all times. That leaves the burden of protection
on the citizen. Yes there are crazy people, but that comes with the human race.

It is shameful that in a discussion about guns people not even from this country have to reduce this to "Bush bashing, redneck hating
christian hating rhetoric.

Please do not be insulted by this, it is not meant to be, just an obsevation.

My European brothers are wonderful people but self admittedly pacifists as earlier posted. This thinking led to 2 wars on your
continent. You need to be somewhat aggressive as a nation or a citizen to be self preservant. And I mean aggresive in a defensive manner


Again Hitler loved the idea of a nation of unarmed people.

"What good fortune for government, that the people do not think."

Adolph Hitler ( history channel)

Written by Arian Totalis on 06.10.2006 at 20:22

Well, it's very simple, ANYONE could kill, even you. My society is not full of would be murderers, I feel safe where I am, I don't feel a threat by my suroundings.

My only assumption is that you feel safe because you're used to living there. When I look at crime rate in the USA, I'm pretty sure I'd forget about night-time activities I do around here.

On another note, I'm not really surprised there's such a high crime rate in a society, where guns are found to be the best solution to protect yourself. I mean, I cannot even imagine myself shooting anyone, and if someone buys a gun, I suppose he's ready to use it. That means he's ready to kill someone should such a need arise. I really wouldn't want to live in such a society.
I find self-defense courses and all those gadgets designed specifically for protection (but not killing!) to be much more reasonable.

Taka

Firstly, in my county there was a loosening of gun restriction about 10 years ago. Crime has been reduced (although not completely because of this), and there have been no more incident or fatalities because of the increase in guns being carried. And yes I do have a carry permit.

You continue to mix apples and oranges by talking about health care and poor people and
U. S. policy abroad. NONE of this has a bit to do with guns and safety. Health care is not a right of existence, but that is another topic.

You are off point again when you speak of our "meritocratic system" or whatever the heck you intend it to be. I don't presume to know all about Switzerland and you sure have no idea about the U.S. and its benevolence. Communities here like all over the world help one another as best possible, same as where you live. And when you speak of U.S. wealth, that was a DIRECT response to the constitution and our form of economy. Sorry to be off topic but you brought these issues up.

I ll forgive you for hating America because you only know what left wing controlled media tells you. It's the same blather they tell our public.

Back to guns. The right to gun ownership is directly related to a peoples freedom.
Keeping this issue local and not global, neighborhoods where people specifically poor people do not have guns, they are at the mercy of criminals.

And lastly, if I remember correctly Australia in recent past has tighted its gun laws and took them from the people where the result was an increase in crime.


Taka, you should please try to stay on gun control and not filibuster about your hatred for the U.S. tnx

I think we "all" may have misconceptions about one anothers societies. Here in major metroplis areas where there is low income
that may creat more crime, but by and large most outer areas are safe except for a few mental coasters!

Hmmmm....I'm wondering....how does everyone here feel after the surge of school violence we have had in the United States recently? Three school shootings in under a week, all in which at least one person died.

Written by Stigmatized on 08.10.2006 at 04:15

Hmmmm....I'm wondering....how does everyone here feel after the surge of school violence we have had in the United States recently? Three school shootings in under a week, all in which at least one person died.

It's one on a million, one guy wants to kill someone, but other cityzens use it for protection.

I think school shooting are good thing to talk about when talking about how loose gun policy affects the society, it's the culture of shooting and having gun laying available all around and secondly I agree what taka said about how also the unfair and very unbalanced structure of society has a lot to do with this. Here's a list of all fatal school killings all over the world, if this list doesn't worry you as a citizen of US i don't know what then..

Bath, Michigan, United States, 1927 (45 dead, 58 injured)
Poe Elementary School, Houston, Texas, 1959 (6 dead)
Cologne, Germany, 1964 (11 dead)
University of Texas, Austin, Texas, United States, 1966 (15 dead, 31 injured)
Avivim school, Israel, 1970 (12 dead, 9 children) (DFLP attacked a school bus)
Ma'alot, Israel, 1974 (26 dead, 60 injured) (DFLP attacked the school)
Olean, New York, United States, 1974 (3 killed, 11 wounded)
St. Pius X High School, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, 1975 (1 killed, 5 wounded)
California State University, Fullerton, California, United States, 1976 (7 dead)
Cleveland Elementary School, San Diego, United States, 1979 (2 killed, 9 wounded)
Goddard Junior High School, Kansas, United States, 1985 (1 killed, 3 wounded)
Missouri, United States, 1987 (1 killed)
Hubbard Woods Elementary, Winnetka, Illinois, United States, 1988 (1 killed, 6 wounded)
Oakland Elementary School, Greenwood, South Carolina, United States, 1988 (2 killes, 8 wounded)
École Polytechnique, Montreal, Quebec, Canada, 1989 (14 dead, 13 injured)
Stockton, California, United States, 1989 (6 dead, 30 injured)
University of Iowa, Iowa City, Iowa, United States, 1991 (5 dead, 1 injured)
Olivehurst, California, United States, 1992 (4 killed, 10 wounded)
Concordia University, Montreal, Quebec, Canada, 1992 (4 dead, 1 injured)
Grayson, Kentucky, United States, 1993 (2 killed)
Jefferson Middle School, Rochester, New York, United States, 1995 (1 killed)
Richland School, Giles County, Tennessee, United States, 1995 (1 killed, 2 wounded)
Jefferson Middle School,Rochester, New York, United States, 1995 (1 killed) Stabbing
Moses Lake, Washington, United States, 1996 (3 killed, 1 wounded)
Dunblane, Scotland, United Kingdom, 1996 (18 dead)
Atlanta, Georgia, United States, 1996 (1 killed)
The Pennsylvania State University, University Park, Pennsylvania, United States, 1996 (1 killed, 1 wounded)
West Palm Beach, Florida, United States, 1997 (1 killed)
Sanaa, Yemen, 1997 (8 dead)
Bethel High School, Bethel, Alaska, United States, 1997 (2 killed, 2 wounded)
Pearl High School,Pearl, Mississippi, United States, 1997 (2 killed, 7 wounded)
Heath High School, West Paducah, Kentucky, United States, 1997 (3 killed, 5 wounded)
Edinboro, Pennsylvania, United States, 1998 (1 killed, 3 wounded)
Craighead County, Arkansas, United States, 1998 (6 dead, 10 injured)
Fayetteville, Tennessee, United States, 1998 (1 killed)
Thurston Senior High School,Springfield, Oregon, United States, 1998 (2 killed, 25 wounded)
W.R Meyers High School, Taber, Alberta, Canada, 1999 (1 killed, 1 wounded)
Deady Middle School, Houston, Texas, United States, 1999 (1 killed) Stabbing
Deming Middle School, Deming, New Mexico, United States, 1999 (1 killed)
Columbine High School, Colorado, United States, 1999 (15 dead, 24 injured)
Brandenburg, Bavaria, Germany, 2000 (1 killed)
West Palm Beach, Florida, United States, 2000 (1 killed)
Mount Morris Township, Michigan, United States, 2000 (1 killed)
Santana High School, Santee, California, United States, 2001 (2 killed, 13 wounded)
Ikeda, Osaka prefecture, Japan, 2001 (8 dead, 15 injured) Stabbing
Erfurt, Germany, 2002 (17 killed)
Vlasenica, Bosnia and Herzegovina, 2002 (1 killed, 1 wounded)
Red Lion, Pennsylvania, United States, 2003 (1 killed)
Rocori High School, Cold Spring, Minnesota, United States, 2003 (2 killed)
Terra College, Den Haag, Netherlands, 2004 (1 killed)
Beslan, Russia, 2004 (344 civilians, 20 service personnel, and 31 attackers dead; over 700 injured) (terrorist group)
Okubo Elementary School,Sasebo, Japan, 2004 (1 killed) Stabbing
Ballou Senior High School, Washington, D.C., United States, 2004 (1 killed)
Southwood Middle School, Palmetto Bay, Florida, United States, 2004 (1 killed) Stabbing
Wallace High School, Gary, Indiana, United States, 2004 (1 killed)
Beijing University, Beijing, China, 2004 (1 killed, 14 wounded) stabbing
Carmen de Patagones,Buenos Aires Province, Argentina, 2004 (3 killed, 5 wounded)
Ruzhou's Number Two High School, Ruzhou, China, 2004 (8 killed, 4 wounded) Stabbing
Jacksboro, Tennessee, United States, 2005 (1 killed, 2 wounded)
Red Lake High School, Minnesota, United States, 2005 (10 dead, 15 injured)
Bailey, Colorado, United States, 2006 (1 killed)
Cazenovia, Wisconsin, United States, 2006 (1 killed)
Dawson College, Montreal, Quebec, Canada, 2006 (2 dead, 19 injured)
Amish school - Nickel Mines, Pennsylvania, United States; 2006 (6 dead, 6 injured)

Remember, these are only fatal ones, there are atleast as big list as this of those ones where fortunately noone got killed.

Yeah in regard to the Israel shooting attacks you mentioned, that coincides with my last post....the black market of guns and drugs in the middle east is very very big, and its not a problem for a criminal to get guns, and if not from Israel some other contributor to terrorrism deals with those weapons.

It is my opinion that some of the U.S. crime issues have several factors.

1. Copycat crimes. It is something we see here often. People see a crime and see its effect or attention it brings and the person
goes off.

2. Age of television. In this new milenia and 24 hour news cycle here a particular story gets played not only at 6pm
like in years past but on ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, CNBC, MSNBC,FOX NEWS and more. Im a news junkie and these stories
are beet to death 24-7.

3. Video games. These kids who now may be grown ups have just lost thier sense of value for life. Now ill make the argument
that this loss of value is cultural and has been breeding since the 60s. There is extreme reverence for ww2 vets but after
that society produced these spoiled children who grew up in the 60s and whom now run our govt.

4. Discipline. The 60s culture also brought lack of discipline. Our schools used to be able to swat a childs behind or use his discretion
to discipline them. Now the child screems ill call the police and the parents threaten to sue. The parents our not doing thier job
to teach the children right from wrong. These children have grown up to be "adults".

Lastly as for crime statistics and gun stats, they have been used, twisted, abused, manipulated etc by both sides of the
argument. People against guns and the NRA are guilty of padding stats, even from a good source. Point is that you will NEVER
remove guns here. It is my right. We need to educate more. Education about firearm safety(which needs to be taught in school)
and basic education. This would increase productivity and reduce crime.

A dozen men with box cutters killed 3000 people. It doenst require a gun, just a decietfull mind.



" No free man shall ever be barred the use to bear arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is as last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."

Thomas Jefferson

You must be right Bluescaponne but at the same time liberal and pacifist europeans don't have this problem in the same level as you can see in the shcool killing stats, we have the same amount of guns (yet more strictly controlled) we have the same video games and same movies, we have even longer history of banning physical discipline and we have the same news.. what is that make so many american kids grab a gun and go shoot bunch of people in their school when so few european kids ends up with that "solution"?

Now you say that education is important factor in reducing crime but earlier you replied to taka that providing healthcare and education to everyone has nothing to do with this.. doesn't really make sense.

Written by [user id=16496] on 07.10.2006 at 15:44

Written by Arian Totalis on 06.10.2006 at 05:10

I feel that We should be allowed to own guns, and to a degree, we do need them. The way I see it, a weapon is a weapon, they're all capable of killing, and it simply depends on the person wielding it. So, that being said, I even believe people should be allowed to own fully automatic assult rifles. Now, I know what your thinking, "Arian you fucking hick, why the HELL do we need that!?!?!" Well, what if someone is a gun collector?, weather it be for historical, or simply apreciative value. Remember, guns don't kill people, people do. It simply depends on the responsibility of the user. If someone is Scitzophrinic, Of course they shouldn't have a Gun! But if they're just someone who wants to have it for the sake of collection, and they have been properly educated, then there isn't a problem. Now I know I'm gonna take some heat for this, so go ahead people, fire away, But quite frankly, I see nothing wrong with my beliefs.

If a person is a gun collector he might get a permission to have guns. That dosent mean all sould get ther fingers on full-automatic firearms as easy as bying anyhing else.

yearh guns dont kill people but people do. But atomic bombs dont kill poeple but the person who orderet it fired does?
But that does not mean that its ok that it is ok if every one could gets their hands on a-bombs. i wouldnt feel secure if evry maniac good get his hands on a full-automatic weapon as easy as in the USA

and think about all the acident with guns when kids and inocent people get killed.

Have you ever seen Bowlin for columbine?

There are actually less gun related accidents, especially with kids, than you might think. Most of the time these things are the result of in-proper gun safety and uneducated people. That's why I say that one should have proper education and background before purchasing a firearm. Even Fully automatic weapons should be allowed to be obtained by the common people as long as they have the proper education and background. so, ya know, I hope you see what I'm saying.

Written by Arian Totalis on 09.10.2006 at 03:14

Written by [user id=16496] on 07.10.2006 at 15:44

Written by Arian Totalis on 06.10.2006 at 05:10

I feel that We should be allowed to own guns, and to a degree, we do need them. The way I see it, a weapon is a weapon, they're all capable of killing, and it simply depends on the person wielding it. So, that being said, I even believe people should be allowed to own fully automatic assult rifles. Now, I know what your thinking, "Arian you fucking hick, why the HELL do we need that!?!?!" Well, what if someone is a gun collector?, weather it be for historical, or simply apreciative value. Remember, guns don't kill people, people do. It simply depends on the responsibility of the user. If someone is Scitzophrinic, Of course they shouldn't have a Gun! But if they're just someone who wants to have it for the sake of collection, and they have been properly educated, then there isn't a problem. Now I know I'm gonna take some heat for this, so go ahead people, fire away, But quite frankly, I see nothing wrong with my beliefs.

If a person is a gun collector he might get a permission to have guns. That dosent mean all sould get ther fingers on full-automatic firearms as easy as bying anyhing else.

yearh guns dont kill people but people do. But atomic bombs dont kill poeple but the person who orderet it fired does?
But that does not mean that its ok that it is ok if every one could gets their hands on a-bombs. i wouldnt feel secure if evry maniac good get his hands on a full-automatic weapon as easy as in the USA

and think about all the acident with guns when kids and inocent people get killed.

Have you ever seen Bowlin for columbine?

There are actually less gun related accidents, especially with kids, than you might think. Most of the time these things are the result of in-proper gun safety and uneducated people. That's why I say that one should have proper education and background before purchasing a firearm. Even Fully automatic weapons should be allowed to be obtained by the common people as long as they have the proper education and background. so, ya know, I hope you see what I'm saying.

There are alot more gun accidents in the US than fx Denmark because why dont carry guns. Yes a result of in-proper gun safety, yes how do whe eleminate in proper gun safty? by dont allowing guns. Uneducated people? why cant uneducated poeple guns if educated poeple can? thats pretty discriminatin.

Written by [user id=16496] on 09.10.2006 at 18:11

Written by Arian Totalis on 09.10.2006 at 03:14

Written by [user id=16496] on 07.10.2006 at 15:44

Written by Arian Totalis on 06.10.2006 at 05:10

I feel that We should be allowed to own guns, and to a degree, we do need them. The way I see it, a weapon is a weapon, they're all capable of killing, and it simply depends on the person wielding it. So, that being said, I even believe people should be allowed to own fully automatic assult rifles. Now, I know what your thinking, "Arian you fucking hick, why the HELL do we need that!?!?!" Well, what if someone is a gun collector?, weather it be for historical, or simply apreciative value. Remember, guns don't kill people, people do. It simply depends on the responsibility of the user. If someone is Scitzophrinic, Of course they shouldn't have a Gun! But if they're just someone who wants to have it for the sake of collection, and they have been properly educated, then there isn't a problem. Now I know I'm gonna take some heat for this, so go ahead people, fire away, But quite frankly, I see nothing wrong with my beliefs.

If a person is a gun collector he might get a permission to have guns. That dosent mean all sould get ther fingers on full-automatic firearms as easy as bying anyhing else.

yearh guns dont kill people but people do. But atomic bombs dont kill poeple but the person who orderet it fired does?
But that does not mean that its ok that it is ok if every one could gets their hands on a-bombs. i wouldnt feel secure if evry maniac good get his hands on a full-automatic weapon as easy as in the USA

and think about all the acident with guns when kids and inocent people get killed.

Have you ever seen Bowlin for columbine?

There are actually less gun related accidents, especially with kids, than you might think. Most of the time these things are the result of in-proper gun safety and uneducated people. That's why I say that one should have proper education and background before purchasing a firearm. Even Fully automatic weapons should be allowed to be obtained by the common people as long as they have the proper education and background. so, ya know, I hope you see what I'm saying.

There are alot more gun accidents in the US than fx Denmark because why dont carry guns. Yes a result of in-proper gun safety, yes how do whe eleminate in proper gun safty? by dont allowing guns. Uneducated people? why cant uneducated poeple guns if educated poeple can? thats pretty discriminatin.

When I say educated, I mean educated in the ways of gun safety, and as long as we know that person has gone through a gun safety course, and carry's a permit on them as proof of this, as well as I.D. Numbers that will leave electronic fingerprints and thus proof that that person has gone through those courses.
Yes, Accidents will always happen, but the same could be said for car accidents. Why don't we just forbid people to drive? Oh yeah, then there are people who drown in swimming accidents, I guess people shouldn't be allowed to swim either. Hell, while we're at it, why don't we just kill everyone so that way we prevent all these accidents ahead of time? You really should stop and question your beliefs instead of just blurting out the bullshit your peers feed you. I live in a dominantly Liberal Area, and my grandfather is a right wing extremist, so I gotta hear bullshit from both sides shoved down my throat, thus I've come to hate them both, but that doesn't mean I can't think for myself what's right and wrong, you should do the same.

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When I say educated, I mean educated in the ways of gun safety, and as long as we know that person has gone through a gun safety course, and carry's a permit on them as proof of this, as well as I.D. Numbers that will leave electronic fingerprints and thus proof that that person has gone through those courses.
Yes, Accidents will always happen, but the same could be said for car accidents. Why don't we just forbid people to drive? Oh yeah, then there are people who drown in swimming accidents, I guess people shouldn't be allowed to swim either. Hell, while we're at it, why don't we just kill everyone so that way we prevent all these accidents ahead of time? You really should stop and question your beliefs instead of just blurting out the bullshit your peers feed you. I live in a dominantly Liberal Area, and my grandfather is a right wing extremist, so I gotta hear bullshit from both sides shoved down my throat, thus I've come to hate them both, but that doesn't mean I can't think for myself what's right and wrong, you should do the same.

ok misunderstood you. But the gun is tool to kill a car is not. The car have a meaningfull purpose to get poeple around the gont dont, In Denmark a kid could not get his fingers on a full-automatic machine gun as the kid in Colombine. look at Europe here we dont use them. But the main problem i have about the very lose gun control in USA ,is guns have become a normal thing to have which i think is fucked up. My grandfather too was pretty rightwing... and so what? i have choosen what i belive in...

Written by Arian Totalis on 09.10.2006 at 18:29

Yes, Accidents will always happen, but the same could be said for car accidents. Why don't we just forbid people to drive?

As far as I know, the purpose of cars is to quickly get from one place to another. Maybe in USA cars are designed to kill people, I'm sure you know that better than me. If so, then yes, I agree. We should forbid people to drive.

Written by [user id=1868] on 09.10.2006 at 19:03

Written by Arian Totalis on 09.10.2006 at 18:29

Yes, Accidents will always happen, but the same could be said for car accidents. Why don't we just forbid people to drive?

As far as I know, the purpose of cars is to quickly get from one place to another. Maybe in USA cars are designed to kill people, I'm sure you know that better than me. If so, then yes, I agree. We should forbid people to drive.

Well guns here in the U.S. are designed for hunting, But people (Less than Some would have you believe)
Still die. Well More people Die over here in car crashes than they do in gun accidents, maby we should look more into the issue of cars?

P.S.- When you quote me, Why the hell don't I get a Notification?

Cool, but I want to know what you have cars there for.
In Poland we use them as means of fast transport that allow us to function normally within the modern society. If people die in car accidents, that's awful, but the cars are here because many people wouldn't be able to reach their jobs, meet with their families and so on without them.
Do you find guns to have a similar importance in the USA? Would you people be unable to function normally without them? I'd find that to be pretty odd, since around here we're doing just fine without them.

And about hunting. Are you people hunting for food or as a hobby? If the latter, then isn't it possible to find something enjoyable to do that doesn't deal with murdering another being?

Written by [user id=1868] on 09.10.2006 at 19:52

Cool, but I want to know what you have cars there for.
In Poland we use them as means of fast transport that allow us to function normally within the modern society. If people die in car accidents, that's awful, but the cars are here because many people wouldn't be able to reach their jobs, meet with their families and so on without them.
Do you find guns to have a similar importance in the USA? Would you people be unable to function normally without them? I'd find that to be pretty odd, since around here we're doing just fine without them.

And about hunting. Are you people hunting for food or as a hobby? If the latter, then isn't it possible to find something enjoyable to do that doesn't deal with murdering another being?

It's true enough that cars are more important to function normally in our society as well, but it's also true that a car is more dangerous than a gun. But even if it's not as needed as say cars are, why the hell can't you let us have our fun, as long as we follow safety? I do hunt for food, But I also do enjoy the experience, I feel that as long as you eat body of what you hunted, then there is nothing wrong with it, to me something must always die so that we may live, and that plants and animals are equals. A person should be allowed to pursue, and do whatever the hell they want, as long as what they're doing does not impose the rights of others, and my having a gun does not impose upon your rights, you do what you want and I do what I want, as long as I don't run out in the street and start shooting you, I'm just fine.