Written by RavenKing on 14.08.2010 at 16:11
Exactly why I think his vocals sound weak and out of place. He sounds like a hard rock/heavy metal singer, not like a Thrash Metal one.
Imo, Thrash is too fast and rough to have vocals sounding as if they would fit in a hard rock, traditional heavy metal or Powermetal band.

Except, it's more tied to, than say a death metal band with clean vocals.

Written by vezzy on 14.08.2010 at 16:14

Written by RavenKing on 14.08.2010 at 16:11
Exactly why I think his vocals sound weak and out of place. He sounds like a hard rock/heavy metal singer, not like a Thrash Metal one.
Imo, Thrash is too fast and rough to have vocals sounding as if they would fit in a hard rock, traditional heavy metal or Powermetal band.

Except, it's more tied to, than say a death metal band with clean vocals.

True. Weak vocals don't fit Thrash but they fit even less Death or Black Metal for sure.

Don't try to tell us
what is right for us
We don't give a fuck anyway
Don't try to steal
imagination from us
Things we believe we
will never betray
Those who have the power to
Suck us try - throw us away
those who never could create
Destroy the music of today
Those devoid of any feeling
Those who make the compromise
Betray themselves to make a deal
Sell their soul at any price
Sounds without feeling, energy or
aggression
From money hungry brains and not
from the heart
Fortune, fame and glory are their
obsessions
Salesmen, deaf to music, blind to art
No honesty, just sterility
A cautious sound they make without
creativity
It's still the same as another age
When they took the words of truth and
put them to a flame
No more
Love us or hate us
No more
Love us or hate us
Some have eyes and still can't see
Their plastic noise is anything but
music to me
Mechanized and computerized
Switch off your brain and make sounds
that dehumanize
No more
Love us or hate us
No more
Love us or hate us
Don't try to take our dreams away
from us
We will never be like you
Love us or hate us, it doesn't matter
to me
We don't want to be a
part of this sick
society
Those who have a passion to
Will never change our way of life
We may not think the way you do
But we know that we are right
Those who want to form a world
Of trends and monotony
Have to do it without us
'Cause we always will be free.

Lyrics to "love us or hate us" from the album: Extreme Aggression

^^

The first time I heard "Love Us Or Hate Us", was on the "Live In Berlin" VHS video. lol

The lyrics to it are awesome, and it is one of the best songs on "Extreme Aggression". Although "Some Pain Will Last" will always be my fave song from that album. xD

Am I the only one who thinks Coma of Souls is overrated? It isn't as great as people say it is.

Written by vezzy on 17.08.2010 at 13:55

Am I the only one who thinks Coma of Souls is overrated? It isn't as great as people say it is.

I think a lot fans class that as the weakest in their "first wave" of thrash albums. Although it's always been my favourite. Mille Petrozza himself once stated he thought the album was full of filler aside from 2 songs. Although he may have started to rethink that opinion, as "When The Sun Burns Red" was added to their setlist for the latest tour.

Written by vezzy on 17.08.2010 at 13:55

Am I the only one who thinks Coma of Souls is overrated? It isn't as great as people say it is.

coma of souls is a bit more atmospheric and dark from the others. the production and the melodies create that feeling imo. it is not an album with "songs to smash your head down" as betrayer or extreme aggression or terrible certainty but without being less thrash it has a different style if you want my opinion. for example agents of brutality and material world paranoia, 2 magnificent songs imo. they are fast and angry but also have many melodic moments. maybe thats what you dont like so much...

Written by Deadmeat on 17.08.2010 at 14:44

coma of souls is a bit more atmospheric and dark from the others. the production and the melodies create that feeling imo. it is not an album with "songs to smash your head down" as betrayer or extreme aggression or terrible certainty but without being less thrash it has a different style if you want my opinion. for example agents of brutality and material world paranoia, 2 magnificent songs imo. they are fast and angry but also have many melodic moments. maybe thats what you dont like so much...

Nope, the reason I don't like it is because it sounds generic.
Also Material World Paranoia makes me think of Hell Awaits.

Written by Deadmeat on 17.08.2010 at 14:44
coma of souls is a bit more atmospheric and dark from the others. the production and the melodies create that feeling imo. it is not an album with "songs to smash your head down" as betrayer or extreme aggression or terrible certainty but without being less thrash it has a different style if you want my opinion. for example agents of brutality and material world paranoia, 2 magnificent songs imo. they are fast and angry but also have many melodic moments. maybe thats what you dont like so much...

Yep, although it is clearly still thrash, it has more melodic qualities than the preceding albums. It even has a track that is more mid paced standard metal. ("People Of The Lie") "Terror Zone" is probably my fave Kreator song. The intro (and outro) harmony riff is totally classic, and the build up to the insane solo and end sections is great. xD "Agents Of Brutality" is another awesome song. The thrash sections are really intense, and I love Frank Blackfire's melodic solo in it.

Written by vezzy on 17.08.2010 at 14:55

Written by Deadmeat on 17.08.2010 at 14:44

coma of souls is a bit more atmospheric and dark from the others. the production and the melodies create that feeling imo. it is not an album with "songs to smash your head down" as betrayer or extreme aggression or terrible certainty but without being less thrash it has a different style if you want my opinion. for example agents of brutality and material world paranoia, 2 magnificent songs imo. they are fast and angry but also have many melodic moments. maybe thats what you dont like so much...

Nope, the reason I don't like it is because it sounds generic.
Also Material World Paranoia makes me think of Hell Awaits.

of what song of hell awaits?

by accident i was listening the last days to hell awaits and i havent noticed anything common. by the way, between slayer and kreator i've noticed 2 common things during the years. 1) a riff on album hell awaits (dont remember that well, i have to check it) which reminds me a riff on song terrible certainty and on the opposite side 2) the first riff on demon prince and the first riff on world painted blood could be easily in the opposite songs imo, or the one to be the continuation of the other as they are very familiar in my ears!

Written by Angelic Storm on 17.08.2010 at 15:01

Written by Deadmeat on 17.08.2010 at 14:44
coma of souls is a bit more atmospheric and dark from the others. the production and the melodies create that feeling imo. it is not an album with "songs to smash your head down" as betrayer or extreme aggression or terrible certainty but without being less thrash it has a different style if you want my opinion. for example agents of brutality and material world paranoia, 2 magnificent songs imo. they are fast and angry but also have many melodic moments. maybe thats what you dont like so much...

and I love Frank Blackfire's melodic solo in it.

how could i forget it? this solo is my fav solo from this album (along with the "crazy" solo in the beginning of material world paranoia) and imo one of the best melodic solos kreator has ever wrote!

Written by Deadmeat on 17.08.2010 at 15:04

of what song of hell awaits?

by accident i was listening the last days to hell awaits and i havent noticed anything common. by the way, between slayer and kreator i've noticed 2 common things during the years. 1) a riff on album hell awaits (dont remember that well, i have to check it) which reminds me a riff on song terrible certainty and on the opposite side 2) the first riff on demon prince and the first riff on world painted blood could be easily in the opposite songs imo, or the one to be the continuation of the other as they are very familiar in my ears!

The title track Hell Awaits. Made me think of it when listening to Material World Paranoia for some reason.

Written by Deadmeat on 17.08.2010 at 15:07
how could i forget it? this solo is my fav solo from this album (along with the "crazy" solo in the beginning of material world paranoia) and imo one of the best melodic solos kreator has ever wrote!

It is indeed great!

Actually, thats another thing I love about "Coma Of Souls". lol The twin lead interplay between Mille and Frank is awesome. I have a great fondness for twin lead guitars, and this aspect of the album is something else I love. xD

Written by vezzy on 17.08.2010 at 15:17

Written by Deadmeat on 17.08.2010 at 15:04

of what song of hell awaits?

by accident i was listening the last days to hell awaits and i havent noticed anything common. by the way, between slayer and kreator i've noticed 2 common things during the years. 1) a riff on album hell awaits (dont remember that well, i have to check it) which reminds me a riff on song terrible certainty and on the opposite side 2) the first riff on demon prince and the first riff on world painted blood could be easily in the opposite songs imo, or the one to be the continuation of the other as they are very familiar in my ears!

The title track Hell Awaits. Made me think of it when listening to Material World Paranoia for some reason.

i just heard those 2 songs and really i cant find a very familiar moment...

Yep, I cant see any similarities between those 2 tracks at all. lol

Written by Angelic Storm on 17.08.2010 at 13:44

^^

The first time I heard "Love Us Or Hate Us", was on the "Live In Berlin" VHS video. lol

The lyrics to it are awesome, and it is one of the best songs on "Extreme Aggression". Although "Some Pain Will Last" will always be my fave song from that album. xD

For me "Love Us Or Hate Us" IS the best song on Extreme Aggression, followed by "No Reason To Exist" , "Extreme Agression" and "Bringer Of Torture"

Edit: Of Course "Stream Of Consciousness and Betrayer" are far better then "Bringer of Torture". I was mixing titles.

Written by vezzy on 17.08.2010 at 13:55

Am I the only one who thinks Coma of Souls is overrated?

I hope so

I've seen them live twice and I will surely go every time there is a concert of them in my country. Their music is so beautiful and genius. Favourite album - Enemy Of God. But I think the fans don't like it so much and maybe that's why they play only the lead song...

Written by Vivi' on 29.01.2011 at 23:38

I've seen them live twice and I will surely go every time there is a concert of them in my country. Their music is so beautiful and genius. Favourite album - Enemy Of God. But I think the fans don't like it so much and maybe that's why they play only the lead song...

no the fans love it! ( i am sure that at your place they love it to!) it's just kreator have many great albums and many many great songs and they like to play (cause we the fans ask it) songs from almost all of their 12 albums. to be honest they play songs from 9-10/12 albums and they play 16-18 songs usually so it's just that they have to play 1 or 2 songs from each album to do this...

Maybe you're right. It's nice that they play a lot of their old stuff live, though.

Written by Deadmeat on 02.02.2011 at 10:18

Written by Vivi' on 29.01.2011 at 23:38

I've seen them live twice and I will surely go every time there is a concert of them in my country. Their music is so beautiful and genius. Favourite album - Enemy Of God. But I think the fans don't like it so much and maybe that's why they play only the lead song...

no the fans love it! ( i am sure that at your place they love it to!) it's just kreator have many great albums and many many great songs and they like to play (cause we the fans ask it) songs from almost all of their 12 albums. to be honest they play songs from 9-10/12 albums and they play 16-18 songs usually so it's just that they have to play 1 or 2 songs from each album to do this...

They should skip all the stuff between "Coma of Souls" and "Violent Revolution", however.
Their albums were shit at that period. We don't need to hear any song from that era live.
It's a period a crushing majority of Kreator fans only wish to erase from their memories.

Written by RavenKing on 02.02.2011 at 14:24

They should skip all the stuff between "Coma of Souls" and "Violent Revolution", however.
Their albums were shit at that period. We don't need to hear any song from that era live.
It's a period a crushing majority of Kreator fans only wish to erase from their memories.

i love in an extreme way their thrash era. but "outcast" and some songs from "renewal" are really good. it is not accidental that "Phobia" has become a classic and is always in their setlist. on the other hand, yeah cause for conflict is nothing great -i havent listened to endorama till now but i'll do it in the next weeks...

Written by Deadmeat on 02.02.2011 at 19:33
i love in an extreme way their thrash era. but "outcast" and some songs from "renewal" are really good. it is not accidental that "Phobia" has become a classic and is always in their setlist. on the other hand, yeah cause for conflict is nothing great -i havent listened to endorama till now but i'll do it in the next weeks...

For me, "Outcast" is the worst Kreator album. For the most part, it's so pedestrian and dull. It has rare moments of greatness, like standouts "Non-Conformist", and the aforementioned classic "Phobia". But overall, it has neither the intensity of their thrash era, nor has it the songwriting nuance, and memorable catchiness of the majority of "Endorama". "Renewal" for me at least, is a pretty good album, despite it's departure from their classic thrash sound. It's still aggressive, albeit in a different way, and most of the songs on it, I really enjoy. xD "Cause For Conflict" is a very messy, inconsistent album. But I love the old-achool scathing thrasher "Catholic Despot", and the explosive "Sculptures Of Regret". 90's Kreator (not including "Coma Of Souls", which I always associate with their 80's albums, despite it being released in 1990. lol) was without doubt, the most inconsistent period of the band, but I still love a fair few songs that came from those albums.

Written by Angelic Storm on 02.02.2011 at 19:44

was without doubt, the most inconsistent period of the band, but I still love a fair few songs that came from those albums.

thats exactly the conclusion i had on my mind.

i agree about outcast, it has some nice songs but it isnt something great either. i was a bit extravagant to be honest...

Written by Deadmeat on 02.02.2011 at 20:19
thats exactly the conclusion i had on my mind.

i agree about outcast, it has some nice songs but it isnt something great either. i was a bit extravagant to be honest...

"Outcast" is way too long. If you took all the good songs from it, you'd probably only have enough for a 5 song EP. More than half the album, is dull filler. The good songs, are very good (even if "Phobia" is the only out and out classic from it), but the album as a whole is pretty tedious. It's definitely the most ambitious Kreator album, but I dont think Mille was cut out for writing that type of material, and it shows.

Written by Angelic Storm on 02.02.2011 at 20:37

Written by Deadmeat on 02.02.2011 at 20:19
thats exactly the conclusion i had on my mind.

i agree about outcast, it has some nice songs but it isnt something great either. i was a bit extravagant to be honest...

"Outcast" is way too long. If you took all the good songs from it, you'd probably only have enough for a 5 song EP. More than half the album, is dull filler. The good songs, are very good (even if "Phobia" is the only out and out classic from it), but the album as a whole is pretty tedious. It's definitely the most ambitious Kreator album, but I dont think Mille was cut out for writing that type of material, and it shows.

yeah... finally i am glad that they are not that talented in playing gothic metal or whatever it can be told and stopped doing it as in thrash they are awesome!

Written by Angelic Storm on 02.02.2011 at 19:44

Written by Deadmeat on 02.02.2011 at 19:33
i love in an extreme way their thrash era. but "outcast" and some songs from "renewal" are really good. it is not accidental that "Phobia" has become a classic and is always in their setlist. on the other hand, yeah cause for conflict is nothing great -i havent listened to endorama till now but i'll do it in the next weeks...

For me, "Outcast" is the worst Kreator album. For the most part, it's so pedestrian and dull. It has rare moments of greatness, like standouts "Non-Conformist", and the aforementioned classic "Phobia". But overall, it has neither the intensity of their thrash era, nor has it the songwriting nuance, and memorable catchiness of the majority of "Endorama". "Renewal" for me at least, is a pretty good album, despite it's departure from their classic thrash sound. It's still aggressive, albeit in a different way, and most of the songs on it, I really enjoy. xD "Cause For Conflict" is a very messy, inconsistent album. But I love the old-achool scathing thrasher "Catholic Despot", and the explosive "Sculptures Of Regret". 90's Kreator (not including "Coma Of Souls", which I always associate with their 80's albums, despite it being released in 1990. lol) was without doubt, the most inconsistent period of the band, but I still love a fair few songs that came from those albums.

For me, "Outcast" quite simply sucks. Nothing worth wasting your time listening to it.
For the record, I find "Phobia" excrutiatingly boring.

"Renewal" is a piece of crap. Only a few rare listenable parts (but not even good). Production makes it sound like complete shit.

"Cause For Conflict" is indeed very inconsistent and messy. To the point it's a pain in the ass to listen to it from beginning to end.

As for "Endorama", I never cared for it. The few songs I heard were total boredom.

What I think is, as much as I absolutely love 80s Kreator and enjoy the post-2000 albums, they were completely lost in the 90s. Unfocused, not having a fucking idea what they were doing. (like pretty much any other Thrash band at that time - the entire decade is to be forgotten when it comes to this genre)

Written by RavenKing on 03.02.2011 at 00:14


"Renewal" is a piece of crap. Only a few rare listenable parts (but not even good). Production makes it sound like complete shit.

i dont know why so many people say that. i love the production of this album. it is different thou but it still is clean and thrashy.
also "zero to none", "europe after the rain" and "brainseed" are very good thrash songs i think and "renewal" (for many people but not for me to be honest) is an anthem....

I really like their experimental phase, Endorama was an amazing album.

Other than that Violent Revolution with its Ghetto war song is probably the best Thrash album I have ever heard.

@Deadmeat: "Zero To None" is actually one of my all time fave Kreator songs, and the other 2 you mention are very good too. Strangely enough though, "Karmic Wheel", which is one of the most experimental songs they've ever done, is also a fave of mine. I love the oppressive atmosphere of that song.

Written by Panzerfaust on 06.02.2011 at 23:12

I really like their experimental phase, Endorama was an amazing album.

Other than that Violent Revolution with its Ghetto war song is probably the best Thrash album I have ever heard.

"Endorama" was really good, and certainly far more consistent than the previous 2 albums. Though it's easy to see why the fans who only like their thrash stuff hate it. lol As for "Ghetto War" it's a decent song, but I find a few of the album's other tracks to be better. Like "Reconquering The Throne", the title track, and "All Of The Same Blood". And the last track "System Decay" is amazing. xD I certainly wouldn't call it the best thrash album Ive heard, or even the best Kreator one, but as their comeback to thrash, it was more than adequate, and is a fine album. Though it's certainly not as great, at least in my eyes, as their classic works, like "Pleasure To Kill", "Terrible Certainty", and my all time fave Kreator album, "Coma Of Souls".