Written by [user id=4365] on 17.06.2014 at 14:06

Of course there are other influences, but none as important as the simplistic melodies used. Take those away and the band would vanish.

An infallible formula is exactly what the bands you posted are doing if you ask me. Safe, easily digestible melody. Nothing more.

Not quite. Publicity and songwriting go hand-in-hand. Without one or the other, in contemporary music, the artist would not reach any level of success.

Perhaps they may be using an infallible formula as well, but it is their unique formula and no other band can recreate it.

Written by LeKiwi on 17.06.2014 at 14:09

Not quite. Publicity and songwriting go hand-in-hand. Without one or the other, in contemporary music, the artist would not reach any level of success.

Perhaps they may be using an infallible formula as well, but it is their unique formula and no other band can recreate it.

But they reach that level of success by conforming to basic, McDonald's-like melody and songwriting. It's pretty basic stuff.

Unique in the sense that no one else has written the exact same songs, but the overall feel, mood and predictable progression of melodies could be found in many other bands most likely. This is why people get so bored of bands like Amon Amarth, because they effectively copy themselves ad infinitum.

Written by [user id=4365] on 17.06.2014 at 14:12

But they reach that level of success by conforming to basic, McDonald's-like melody and songwriting. It's pretty basic stuff.

Unique in the sense that no one else has written the exact same songs, but the overall feel, mood and predictable progression of melodies could be found in many other bands most likely. This is why people get so bored of bands like Amon Amarth, because they effectively copy themselves ad infinitum.

Combined with publicity - it doesn't work any other way.

No, unique in the sense that I've not heard any artist write melodies in the way AA does. If you can find one, I'd be truly baffled. Yes, there are dozens of artists which use the same keys and related scales, but you must be able to identify the stylistic ways in which they employ these to form a unique melodic style. Indeed, bands like AA, Insomnium, Scar Symmetry, and Wintersun employ their formula over, and over, and over. I'm not denying that.

Written by LeKiwi on 17.06.2014 at 14:16

Combined with publicity - it doesn't work any other way.

No, unique in the sense that I've not heard any artist write melodies in the way AA does. If you can find one, I'd be truly baffled. Yes, there are dozens of artists which use the same keys and related scales, but you must be able to identify the stylistic ways in which they employ these to form a unique melodic style. Indeed, bands like AA, Insomnium, Scar Symmetry, and Wintersun employ their formula over, and over, and over. I'm not denying that.

The stylistic ways they use get to get to the same melodies is totally irrelevant in my opinion. Bands may employ different guitar sounds, more technical drum work, the use of keyboards and so, but ultimately they make effectively the same music. It's about the result, not the method. This is why Scar Symmetry are just as plainly generic as Amon Amarth to me. They do things in different ways but the result is practically the same from an artistic perspective. That's what you don't seem to be able to grasp.

This has gone on too long anyway and is wildly off topic.

Written by X-Ray Rod on 17.06.2014 at 14:20

Woah, you are seriously comparing the bands in terms of popularity? Extreme metal will never be as popular as the other kinds of metal which are easier to get into. That one is a fact but it has nothing to do with quality... It's simply because the average person doesn't like extreme music because it's difficult to get into.

I'm comparing their popularity relatively. That's the key point. I wouldn't dare compare anything in extreme metal to the likes of ______-core.

Guys, just stop. In case there's a thread regarding popularity of bands and on what that popularity is based on: Feel free to go nuts since it will be on-topic there.
But not here. For your own damn good. If the person below me continues with that discussion. I don't care who it is. That person is dumb. D:

So........ yeaaaaaaah. I like Esoteric. Ironically The song that was a subject to the previous, off-topic discussion is one of my favorite ones. Who woulda thunk, eh?
I also like that they took off the abrassiveness (which I loved btw) of The Maniacal Vale and instead made something more I dunno... Floaty(?).

Written by [user id=4365] on 17.06.2014 at 14:21

The stylistic ways they use get to get to the same melodies is totally irrelevant in my opinion. Bands may employ different guitar sounds, more technical drum work, the use of keyboards and so, but ultimately they make effectively the same music. It's about the result, not the method. This is why Scar Symmetry are just as plainly generic as Amon Amarth to me. They do things in different ways but the result is practically the same from an artistic perspective. That's what you don't seem to be able to grasp.

This has gone on too long anyway and is wildly off topic.

It's not irrelevant because the output differs, because an unheard AA or SS song can easily be identified as belonging to those bands. Style = output. Here I sit, waiting for anyone to give me an example of another band that writes in the same melodic style as any of the bands I mentioned - I don't think it will ever come...

Indeed, from an artistic perspective, they all take the same approach and milk their formula to death. That's besides the point. People enjoy the milking and will continue to do so.

Back on-topic. From now on ALL off-topic posts will be deleted.

I didn't see that post before I replied. I'm done in any case, this is pointless.

On-topic: didn't enjoy, 4/10.

I really don't understand what happened there. But...well at least something good came out of it all: it made me listen to the album for the first time. I think I'll need to go back to The Maniacal Vale to be able to form a more complete opinion of this one.

Seeings as how my warnings of Jeshua's coming persecution of non-believers in this album were deemed irrelevant...

This is really a great album, no Maniacal Vale of course, but that's really not saying much, as that album was pretty much Esoteric's Si Monumentum Requires, Circumspice... phenomenal release that's near impossible to top. I agree with Rod that the aggression being sacrificed for "floatiness" here works wonders, the atmosphere is very easy to get lost in, and the leads are definitely not "medicore." As was previously suggested, you have to take them in reference the band itself, not compared against other bands like "oh, this is how they do it, so if it's not like this, it's shit." This music is very ambient-driven with not a large complexity of structure, so these free-flowing, rather minimalist leads are nothing short of fitting in my opinion.

Written by Auntie Sahar on 18.06.2014 at 01:15

Seeings as how my warnings of Jeshua's coming persecution of non-believers in this album were deemed irrelevant...

This is really a great album, no Maniacal Vale of course, but that's really not saying much, as that album was pretty much Esoteric's Si Monumentum Requires, Circumspice... phenomenal release that's near impossible to top. I agree with Rod that the aggression being sacrificed for "floatiness" here works wonders, the atmosphere is very easy to get lost in, and the leads are definitely not "medicore." As was previously suggested, you have to take them in reference the band itself, not compared against other bands like "oh, this is how they do it, so if it's not like this, it's shit." This music is very ambient-driven with not a large complexity of structure, so these free-flowing, rather minimalist leads are nothing short of fitting in my opinion.

This whole thread is making me want to give Esoteric a discog playthrough. Has been a while since I've really sat down and listened to them and there's still quite a few records I've never heard of theirs.

Written by Auntie Sahar on 18.06.2014 at 01:15

definitely not "medicore."

Is this a new genre? =D

Written by Karlabos on 18.06.2014 at 01:23

Is this a new genre? =D

Doctor themed metalcore

Written by mz on 17.06.2014 at 13:40

Also, here is the chalange: if esoteric are generic, find a couple of bands playing a similar sort of funeral doom. I've been looking for such thing for long and all I have got are AC and faal (which are clearly influenced by esoteric and follow it)

You may also want to check out (if you haven't already) Russia's Station Dysthymia. They're influenced by Esoteric as well, and their most recent album (Overhead, Without Any Fuss, The Stars Were Going Out) was actually mastered by Chandler, but still... if you're looking for some more Esoteric-ish funeral doom, highly recommended. Actually got my Extreme Doom vote in the MSA last year.

Written by [user id=4365] on 18.06.2014 at 01:24

Written by Karlabos on 18.06.2014 at 01:23

Is this a new genre? =D

Doctor themed metalcore

I'm sure Rod would know all about that

Written by Auntie Sahar on 18.06.2014 at 01:27

I'm sure Rod would know all about that

I'm sure Rod would love a genre based on him. Would consist of short songs

Written by Auntie Sahar on 18.06.2014 at 01:25

You may also want to check out (if you haven't already) Russia's Station Dysthymia. They're influenced by Esoteric as well, and their most recent album (Overhead, Without Any Fuss, The Stars Were Going Out) was actually mastered by Chandler, but still... if you're looking for some more Esoteric-ish funeral doom, highly recommended. Actually got my Extreme Doom vote in the MSA last year.

Yeah I heard that, too but didn't like it that much. Should give it another go, though.

Esoteric always delivers...

Written by X-Ray Rod on 17.06.2014 at 14:23

I also like that they took off the abrassiveness (which I loved btw) of The Maniacal Vale and instead made something more I dunno... Floaty(?).

I know exactly what you mean. Although not quite as good as its predecessor it's still utterly amazing in a different way.

EDIT: Okay, almost everyone's gonna disagree here (even past-me) but I'm starting to prefer this one over TMV actually...

EDITEDIT: Fuck it, this is the greatest thing ever.

Written by LeKiwi on 17.06.2014 at 14:27

I didn't see that post before I replied. I'm done in any case, this is pointless.

On-topic: didn't enjoy, 4/10.

4/10 seriously? You don't like Funeral Doom?

Written by LeKiwi on 17.06.2014 at 14:27
Above most of the aspects of musicianship, I value the melodic capability. The last example, is simply tasteless. Anyone with a musical ear can tell you the same.

What was the point of that comparison? These melodies were simple, fast and catchy. Esoteric melodies are atmospheric/psychedelic/melancholic. Try again with this album and song 'Disconsolate'. It is full of totally awesome melodies.

The "Similar Artists" tab should be disabled for Esoteric. There's no other band that sounds like this.

Written by Satyr73 on 28.08.2015 at 18:58

The "Similar Artists" tab should be disabled for Esoteric. There's no other band that sounds like this.

So fucking true.

Written by Maco on 21.10.2015 at 06:25

Written by Satyr73 on 28.08.2015 at 18:58

The "Similar Artists" tab should be disabled for Esoteric. There's no other band that sounds like this.

So fucking true.

Hmm, logic tells me that you both have either already heard ALL existing doom bands and ALL of their records or are just carelessly making groundless statements to others, aren't you?
Eh, anyway, just teasing you.

Written by [user id=4365] on 18.06.2014 at 01:28

Written by Auntie Sahar on 18.06.2014 at 01:27

I'm sure Rod would know all about that

I'm sure Rod would love a genre based on him. Would consist of short songs

Oh man... I was just passing through here and I got hit by a 1,5 years old insult. What a monday.

Written by Tomas Piller on 28.12.2015 at 12:36

Eh, anyway, just teasing you.

k

Written by X-Ray Rod on 28.12.2015 at 13:49

Oh man... I was just passing through here and I got hit by a 1,5 years old insult. What a monday.

:lo: don't even remember saying that one. Not bad though, for me

Listened to this about 50 times now I am still wondering when it will become great. This album is a bit overrated Imo, side a is quite good spacerock/post-rock/doom but side b falls flat. The vocals from Esoteric is always masterful but the music here isnt inspiring.

Written by [user id=157444] on 09.10.2016 at 10:54

side a is quite good spacerock/post-rock/doom but side b falls flat.

That's weird, disc 2 has Disconsolate on it, which might be my favorite song of theirs. Do you prefer their other releases or can you not get into the band in general?

Written by Zap on 09.10.2016 at 11:56

Written by [user id=157444] on 09.10.2016 at 10:54

side a is quite good spacerock/post-rock/doom but side b falls flat.

That's weird, disc 2 has Disconsolate on it, which might be my favorite song of theirs. Do you prefer their other releases or can you not get into the band in general?

The band has gone from great to good for me. I am in the process of devaluating them

*Listeninging again *
As i wrote earlier the vocals are carrying the song. Maybe my equalizer is mixed the wrong way, to me the music sounds a bit light in relation to the vocals. Totally oustanding vocals though. Very good song now that i listen to it again. Maybe this album is a 9 after all