As someone mentioned South Park earlier, here's a quote from one of the goth kids in the Raisins episode:

"If you wanna be one of the non-conformists, all you have to do is dress just like us and listen to the same music we do."

Written by crow on 25.02.2011 at 08:10

As someone mentioned South Park earlier, here's a quote from one of the goth kids in the Raisins episode:

"If you wanna be one of the non-conformists, all you have to do is dress just like us and listen to the same music we do."

Haha, yeah I love the irony in that. Could it be argued that these Gothic Beiber kids are non conformists in a non conformist genre? Hmm, I wonder.

Written by [user id=107773] on 25.02.2011 at 14:31

Written by crow on 25.02.2011 at 08:10

As someone mentioned South Park earlier, here's a quote from one of the goth kids in the Raisins episode:

"If you wanna be one of the non-conformists, all you have to do is dress just like us and listen to the same music we do."

Haha, yeah I love the irony in that. Could it be argued that these Gothic Beiber kids are non conformists in a non conformist genre? Hmm, I wonder.

Metal really isn't a non-conformist genre, despite the illusion. Take this thread of as an example of why it isn't.

Written by Doc G. on 25.02.2011 at 16:52

Written by [user id=107773] on 25.02.2011 at 14:31

Written by crow on 25.02.2011 at 08:10

As someone mentioned South Park earlier, here's a quote from one of the goth kids in the Raisins episode:

"If you wanna be one of the non-conformists, all you have to do is dress just like us and listen to the same music we do."

Haha, yeah I love the irony in that. Could it be argued that these Gothic Beiber kids are non conformists in a non conformist genre? Hmm, I wonder.

Metal really isn't a non-conformist genre, despite the illusion. Take this thread of as an example of why it isn't.

Suppose, this thread would give that impression.

I can't stand these "metalheads". I'm 16, and all I see around school are Whitechapel and Suicide Silence shirts. It makes me sick. Only a few friends and I seem to like decent bands. We listen to old school stuff and newer bands like Violator, Havok, etc., and people have told US our taste is awful.

Just the same in my hometown. a lot of people, also kids buy band t-shirts but really have no idea on what they're wearing. they only pretend to be metalhead, and it sucks. they never even listen to old bands ! there's a case like this: some of them say BMTH is a death metal band. one of them once said "Broken Hope is emo (just because of the band's name !), Suffocation is metalcore (he listened to Blood Oath, and he said "death metal songs should be fast, they played it slow in this album so I would call it metalcore)". yeah I know Blood Oath is boring, but saying Suffocation is a metalcore band and Broken Hope is emo jsut because of the band's name ? WTF !

Written by WickedBuddhi on 25.02.2011 at 03:11

I agree with the lot of you. But like one person mentioned, I think it's just a phase. As teenagers, you don't really know your ass from your elbow-- and pretty much buy into anything. "All you know about me is what I sold ya." These kids bought into a culture that isn't necessarily metal... it's Hot Topic, It's major labels signing and selling the next look. Is it their fault? To an extent but everyone wants to belong something, I figure. Just another mixed bag of lost souls in my book.

I didn't get into heavy metal till I was about 17. I never dressed up or even attempted to walk the walk or talk the talk, but much what was being said through the music I agreed with and held onto. If one song taught me anything at a young age what it is to be metal. it's Metal Church's The Powers That Be from Blessing in Disguise.

I got into metal in the late nineties when nu metal and mook rock were popular, and I'm pretty sure the real metalheads were laughing at guys like me who listened to Limp Bizkit and Papa Roach just because it was playing on rock radio. And yeah, alot of that shit was terrible, but it introduced me to metal and got me hooked on the real shit. For most of them it will probably be a phase like you say, but a few others will get bitten.

There's this attitude in metal where, regardless of how long you've been into metal, you believe yourself to be superior to other metal fans. It doesn't apply to everyone but a I get a bit sick of reading it on forums. It's about the younger kids just getting into this music being posers of some sort. When we were all starting to get into the less mainstream metal bands, we didn't like these old metalheads telling us how much better they are because they've been listening to metal for X amount of years, they own hundreds of CDs and liked a particular band before they were cool but gradually most metalheads become elitist scenesters.

Let's stop the Metaller-than-thou pissing contest. We weren't all born clutching a copy of Master of Puppets. We all go on metal forums and go to metal gigs because we like metal. Let's leave it at that and stop analysing each other.

Written by -tom- on 26.02.2011 at 14:35

There's this attitude in metal where, regardless of how long you've been into metal, you believe yourself to be superior to other metal fans. It doesn't apply to everyone but a I get a bit sick of reading it on forums. It's about the younger kids just getting into this music being posers of some sort. When we were all starting to get into the less mainstream metal bands, we didn't like these old metalheads telling us how much better they are because they've been listening to metal for X amount of years, they own hundreds of CDs and liked a particular band before they were cool but gradually most metalheads become elitist scenesters.

Let's stop the Metaller-than-thou pissing contest. We weren't all born clutching a copy of Master of Puppets. We all go on metal forums and go to metal gigs because we like metal. Let's leave it at that and stop analysing each other.

Maybe it is the hazing from the old school metal heads that made us better metal heads. Hell I went through my SlipKnot goth kid phase and all the guys that grew up seeing the destuction of Metallica and the Rise of Slayer showed me how much better metal can be. And you're right as metal heads we do have high ego and need to mesure dicks because thats part of it, to be the best. So I say keep giving the little pukes shit and punching them in the face with a copy of Rein in Blood or Butchered at Birth.

Well it's been a while since I cared about being the best at metal. I used to think it was cool that I listened to bands that not many people had heard of. Then i realised that System of a Down were better than most of those bands anyway.

Opinions are subjective and I don't think that metalhead elitism is about teaching the new kids about good metal, as you suggest. We all go to gigs to have a good time and listen to music. Why people get upset about what other people at these gigs look like and what they're drinking (referring to first post here) is beyond me.

Written by BrokenKnuckles on 26.02.2011 at 15:05

Written by -tom- on 26.02.2011 at 14:35

There's this attitude in metal where, regardless of how long you've been into metal, you believe yourself to be superior to other metal fans. It doesn't apply to everyone but a I get a bit sick of reading it on forums. It's about the younger kids just getting into this music being posers of some sort. When we were all starting to get into the less mainstream metal bands, we didn't like these old metalheads telling us how much better they are because they've been listening to metal for X amount of years, they own hundreds of CDs and liked a particular band before they were cool but gradually most metalheads become elitist scenesters.

Let's stop the Metaller-than-thou pissing contest. We weren't all born clutching a copy of Master of Puppets. We all go on metal forums and go to metal gigs because we like metal. Let's leave it at that and stop analysing each other.

Maybe it is the hazing from the old school metal heads that made us better metal heads.

Well, fuck me! If I died yesterday, I would have never known you can actually be a "better" metal head than someone.
What makes one metal head better than another? That he listens to more extreme or underground bands or something? I honestly fail understand the comparison of a metal head's quality and the standards by which you judge.
Besides, even most of those Hot Topic bands that you hate so much have more quality music than Butchered at Birth... The only reason why that album is even known by anyone is because it was one of the first from the great Cannibal Corpse (who got much better later). Other than that, it's barely worth shit.

Written by Slayer666 on 26.02.2011 at 17:31

a) What makes one metal head better than another? That he listens to more extreme or underground bands or something?

b) Besides, even most of those Hot Topic bands that you hate so much have more quality music than Butchered at Birth... The only reason why that album is even known by anyone is because it was one of the first from the great Cannibal Corpse (who got much better later). Other than that, it's barely worth shit.

a) Yes. It's not my opinion, just elitism. The more underground, the more extreme, the more "against the grain" you are, the more "metal" you are.

b) BaB is in my opinion far better than any Hot Topic deathcore band.

Written by King_of_the_Kill on 26.02.2011 at 03:54

I can't stand these "metalheads". I'm 16, and all I see around school are Whitechapel and Suicide Silence shirts. It makes me sick. Only a few friends and I seem to like decent bands. We listen to old school stuff and newer bands like Violator, Havok, etc., and people have told US our taste is awful.

I know how it is its the same here...
I was probably the only man in my school that listened to Bathory,Burzum and rest of old school stuff...

Written by -tom- on 26.02.2011 at 14:35

There's this attitude in metal where, regardless of how long you've been into metal, you believe yourself to be superior to other metal fans. It doesn't apply to everyone but a I get a bit sick of reading it on forums. It's about the younger kids just getting into this music being posers of some sort. When we were all starting to get into the less mainstream metal bands, we didn't like these old metalheads telling us how much better they are because they've been listening to metal for X amount of years, they own hundreds of CDs and liked a particular band before they were cool but gradually most metalheads become elitist scenesters.

Let's stop the Metaller-than-thou pissing contest. We weren't all born clutching a copy of Master of Puppets. We all go on metal forums and go to metal gigs because we like metal. Let's leave it at that and stop analysing each other.

Legendary person. I get tired of always being the one to say these things

If I came off sounding elitist, I apologize for the Tool and Metal Church reference. I don't care what the asswipes listen to. I just think the teenagers were sold an image and an attitude. But shit, Rob Halford brought the whole (gay) leather look.... so, maybe I am being harsh. I don't know-- it's just entertainment. But seriously, Metal Church!

Written by -tom- on 26.02.2011 at 16:47

Well it's been a while since I cared about being the best at metal. I used to think it was cool that I listened to bands that not many people had heard of. Then i realised that System of a Down were better than most of those bands anyway.

Opinions are subjective and I don't think that metalhead elitism is about teaching the new kids about good metal, as you suggest. We all go to gigs to have a good time and listen to music. Why people get upset about what other people at these gigs look like and what they're drinking (referring to first post here) is beyond me.

I dunno what it is, but this "metalhead elitism", seems to be an exclusively male trait. lol I'm not saying there aren't any girls who also do it, but I can say that I've never personally seen it. I do think it's just extention of the male ego, and trying to prove they are better than others. (posers, in their eyes)

Written by [user id=107773] on 26.02.2011 at 21:33
Legendary person. I get tired of always being the one to say these things

Ditto!

Its called teens being teens. Not fitting in with most of their peers, they try and forge a unique identiy for themselves. Business knows this, and markets them alternative music and fasion, so that they can belive that they are different, rather then just a tool of the companies. They'll grow out of it.

For the record, my wannabe goth teen angst phase lasted an enire 2 weeks

Written by Angelic Storm on 27.02.2011 at 00:42

Written by -tom- on 26.02.2011 at 16:47

Well it's been a while since I cared about being the best at metal. I used to think it was cool that I listened to bands that not many people had heard of. Then i realised that System of a Down were better than most of those bands anyway.

Opinions are subjective and I don't think that metalhead elitism is about teaching the new kids about good metal, as you suggest. We all go to gigs to have a good time and listen to music. Why people get upset about what other people at these gigs look like and what they're drinking (referring to first post here) is beyond me.

I dunno what it is, but this "metalhead elitism", seems to be an exclusively male trait. lol I'm not saying there aren't any girls who also do it, but I can say that I've never personally seen it. I do think it's just extention of the male ego, and trying to prove they are better than others. (posers, in their eyes)

Agreed, though there is an element of ratio to consider [certainly on this site at least]. I don't think if half the females on this site had the same elitist point of view it would match the males. Having said that, it is definitely logical to assume it a male trait in my opinion.

Written by [user id=107773] on 27.02.2011 at 01:17

Agreed, though there is an element of ratio to consider [certainly on this site at least]. I don't think if half the females on this site had the same elitist point of view it would match the males. Having said that, it is definitely logical to assume it a male trait in my opinion.

That is a valid point... I can't say elitism in metal is exclusive to males only, but Id guess that generally speaking at least, it is. I think it certainly is true, that females are far less likely to call someone a "poser" or negatively judge them just for liking a certain band, or wearing certain clothes. Although it is very true that women on this site (and most other metal sites most likely) are far outnumbered by the men, I still think what I said holds true, at least generally speaking.

I have been reading people have been saying things like this about younger/newer Metal fans on forums such as this ever since I first got onto the internet about 10 years ago (although I've not heard it said so much in real life), so if you are under 25 then you can be very sure that many people were saying exactly the same about you when you were new to the scene. No new Metal fans today will give us a very underwhelming Metal scene in 10 years time.

The worst offenders for elitism in my experience are people who have a been into Metal for a few years, know about a few more bands than those that they mock, know what Wikipedia says about it but couldn't have written it themselves without having Wikipedia already written by somone else to copy from; it is a lack of self-confidence issue I think. It is also mostly an internet phenomenon; the internet seems to bring out some people's inner bitch.

Written by john_mcc on 27.02.2011 at 04:28

I have been reading people have been saying things like this about younger/newer Metal fans on forums such as this ever since I first got onto the internet about 10 years ago (although I've not heard it said so much in real life), so if you are under 25 then you can be very sure that many people were saying exactly the same about you when you were new to the scene. No new Metal fans today will give us a very underwhelming Metal scene in 10 years time.

The worst offenders for elitism in my experience are people who have a been into Metal for a few years, know about a few more bands than those that they mock, know what Wikipedia says about it but couldn't have written it themselves without having Wikipedia already written by somone else to copy from; it is a lack of self-confidence issue I think. It is also mostly an internet phenomenon; the internet seems to bring out some people's inner bitch.

+1

I was telling the same thing,but my English is insufficient....

Written by john_mcc on 27.02.2011 at 04:28

I have been reading people have been saying things like this about younger/newer Metal fans on forums such as this ever since I first got onto the internet about 10 years ago (although I've not heard it said so much in real life), so if you are under 25 then you can be very sure that many people were saying exactly the same about you when you were new to the scene. No new Metal fans today will give us a very underwhelming Metal scene in 10 years time.

The worst offenders for elitism in my experience are people who have a been into Metal for a few years, know about a few more bands than those that they mock, know what Wikipedia says about it but couldn't have written it themselves without having Wikipedia already written by somone else to copy from; it is a lack of self-confidence issue I think. It is also mostly an internet phenomenon; the internet seems to bring out some people's inner bitch.

Great post, that is so true as well.

Written by Troy Killjoy on 26.02.2011 at 17:51

Written by Slayer666 on 26.02.2011 at 17:31

a) What makes one metal head better than another? That he listens to more extreme or underground bands or something?

b) Besides, even most of those Hot Topic bands that you hate so much have more quality music than Butchered at Birth... The only reason why that album is even known by anyone is because it was one of the first from the great Cannibal Corpse (who got much better later). Other than that, it's barely worth shit.

a) Yes. It's not my opinion, just elitism. The more underground, the more extreme, the more "against the grain" you are, the more "metal" you are.

b) BaB is in my opinion far better than any Hot Topic deathcore band.

Cannibal Corpse IS a hot topic band. Seriously. Sorry to burst everyones elite bubble.

Written by King_of_the_Kill on 26.02.2011 at 03:54

I can't stand these "metalheads". I'm 16, and all I see around school are Whitechapel and Suicide Silence shirts. It makes me sick. Only a few friends and I seem to like decent bands. We listen to old school stuff and newer bands like Violator, Havok, etc., and people have told US our taste is awful.

Some day, you will look back on this and say to yourself "I'm so glad I was cooler than everyone else".
Seriously though, what's wrong with some schoolmates wearing Suicide Silence shirts? How does this harm you in any way? It's a very shallow, fairly unintelligent mindset to so proudly sport.

So people like shitty bands? Get over it.

Because I'm to lazy to reiterate everything that's wrong with this silly misguided high-and-mighty self-perception, I'll just paste an answer to this thread that sums everything up nicely:

Written by -tom- on 26.02.2011 at 14:35

There's this attitude in metal where, regardless of how long you've been into metal, you believe yourself to be superior to other metal fans. It doesn't apply to everyone but a I get a bit sick of reading it on forums. It's about the younger kids just getting into this music being posers of some sort. When we were all starting to get into the less mainstream metal bands, we didn't like these old metalheads telling us how much better they are because they've been listening to metal for X amount of years, they own hundreds of CDs and liked a particular band before they were cool but gradually most metalheads become elitist scenesters.

Let's stop the Metaller-than-thou pissing contest. We weren't all born clutching a copy of Master of Puppets. We all go on metal forums and go to metal gigs because we like metal. Let's leave it at that and stop analysing each other.

Bumped. Because it should be read by everyone before posting here.

Written by WickedBuddhi on 26.02.2011 at 22:56

If I came off sounding elitist, I apologize for the Tool and Metal Church reference. I don't care what the asswipes listen to. I just think the teenagers were sold an image and an attitude. But shit, Rob Halford brought the whole (gay) leather look.... so, maybe I am being harsh. I don't know-- it's just entertainment. But seriously, Metal Church!

It's not necesarily as you put it. I guess when I was 15 i could have been described as a skateboarding scenester by my appearance but then I did skate for at least a few hours almost every day. It's probably more about expressing your interests through how you dress then buying into an image.

It's the age old question of what came first; the CDs or the Merch.

I must say that I've encountered such people as preteens that have the gothic justin bieber look and are very noisy and anoying.
On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

I must say that I've encountered such people as preteens that have the gothic justin bieber look and are very noisy and anoying.
On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

Well, disliking dickheads because they act like dickheads is a whole different story though.

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

I must say that I've encountered such people as preteens that have the gothic justin bieber look and are very noisy and anoying.
On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

That sounds like an ideal gig. Everyone should be jumping around and moshing. Hate it when i go to gigs where the crowd doesn't seem to care if the band are playing.

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

I must say that I've encountered such people as preteens that have the gothic justin bieber look and are very noisy and anoying.
On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

i used to be one of those guys. now i just moved to the next age bracket. i still drink, i still sing, and i still mosh around. what you call pathetic, i call cathartic and fun.

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.

i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.

i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

what we have learned from this thread is metal is only for twentysomethings who take it SERIOUSLY and watch their shows sober and standing in place, arms crossed.