Unofficial sources for database edits
Posts: 130
Visited by: 269 users
Original post
Posted by psykometal, 12.06.2013 - 10:17
Admittedly sites like Metal Archives and Wikipedia are great places for finding a starting point such as images, official site links or general album info. But even that info still needs to be verified using official sources to verify that what you "found" there is correct. If you can't verify all the info through the band's official sites then you can start turning to some alternative options. You can try checking the band's label site(s). In the case of albums, look them up on sites like Bandcamp, iTunes, Spotify, Amazon, etc.. You can try doing Google searches for news articles on sites like Blabbermouth, Metal Sucks, Metal Injection, Metal Underground, Brave Words/Bloody Knuckles, etc.. You can also try Google searching for band interviews.
It should be common knowledge by now, especially to people who have "earned" the permissions to submit edits without a Staff-check and those who can also accept other user's submissions, that places like MA have a tendency to be grossly inaccurate and loaded with bad info. So STOP submitting/accepting information with sites like MA or Wikipedia as the source! Otherwise I might decide to take away your ability to edit anything unchecked for a determinate amount of time.
Some very well known, AND UNACCEPTABLE, unofficial sites:
AllMusic
last.fm
Metal Archives
Metal Kingdom
Rate Your Music
Spirit Of Metal (which is practically a copy/paste of MA anyway)
Wikipedia
mikseri.net
One of the pride and joys that I and many others, before and alongside me, have had through the years is the pleasure of shaping Metal Storm's database into something different and unique instead of just a copy/paste of sites like Metal Archives and Wikipedia. We are vastly different and far more accurate and complete than Metal Archives or Wikipedia will ever be because we only submit/accept properly verified information. Each and every one of our Database Chiefs (myself included), and several other Staff and many of our Contributors, Elites, and Users have gone to great lengths to ensure that we are not just a copy/paste of Metal Archives and Wikipedia.
So please, help me and the rest of the Metal Storm Staff keep this database the most awesome, unique and accurate database for Metal (and related) music on the internet!
| ANGEL REAPER Posts: 3687  |
A quick question guys :is this also apply when it comes to adding lyrics ? i mean the edit request source link right? so what when we find that source matches the actual lyrics (by listening or by album booklet or otherwise).To specify that in edit comments?
---- "Cross is only an iron,hope is just an illusion,freedom is nothing but a name..." "Build your walls of the dead stone...Build your roofs of a dead wood..Build your dreams of a dead thoughts" 
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595  |
Written by ANGEL REAPER on 27.08.2013 at 16:48  I think this may help you out. Written by psykometal on 12.06.2013 at 17:08
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| ANGEL REAPER Posts: 3687 |
Written by Cynic Metalhead on 27.08.2013 at 22:14 we must specify source but the actual material can be our own transcription of booklet ...lets say we have a booklet,than the lyrics are 100%original ant official ,and it also in the same time confirms the lyrics found on some website (even one specified as unofficial )..i mean we can put that link to that website and comment that we confirmed said material.
---- "Cross is only an iron,hope is just an illusion,freedom is nothing but a name..." "Build your walls of the dead stone...Build your roofs of a dead wood..Build your dreams of a dead thoughts"
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
Written by ANGEL REAPER on 27.08.2013 at 22:19 Just like it happens when accepting album from the user citing "album booklet". You know, we cross-checked and then accept it. In this case, it will be better if you mentioned about that link(official or unofficial) and have added lyrics from the booklet. Any perm user will further look into that matter.
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| ANGEL REAPER Posts: 3687 |
Written by Cynic Metalhead on 27.08.2013 at 22:38 ok if staff do cross checks than its not a big problem than thanks anyway
---- "Cross is only an iron,hope is just an illusion,freedom is nothing but a name..." "Build your walls of the dead stone...Build your roofs of a dead wood..Build your dreams of a dead thoughts"
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
People haven't checked out this forum yet I guess. I'm(along with many elites, staff or contributors) still getting MA link as their main source. Stop dragging the fragmented information from MA. Follow the guidelines here. :/
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135  |
Written by Cynic Metalhead on 13.01.2014 at 12:57 me to many times, I would say 4 from 10 album eddits, but most are wrong codes, cas violation , rest are sources, i reject (unless I am shore MA source is good , since 2 imes MS news was same info as MA, I gave note to ms news and accept but said about unofficial sources
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die"  I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
Written by Cynic Metalhead on 13.01.2014 at 12:57 and you just accepted eddit where In English song titles, Every Word Should Be Capitalized was violated :hopless:
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
Metal archive sposted update A quick announcement regarding album lineups / 2014-02-04 10:53 reda it  finally they understood they datebase is runed buy XXXXXX and are full whit error
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| psykometal A staff guy... Elite Posts: 6101  |
Written by Cynic Metalhead on 13.01.2014 at 12:57 I hope you're rejecting them so as to teach them a lesson...
---- ~Zep, Database and Forum Moderation~ 
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
Written by psykometal on 01.03.2014 at 05:13 Yes, I'm doing it, sir. Except for logos which I sometimes have to go to MA.
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
Written by [user id=101272] on 21.03.2014 at 18:37 Darklyrics is much convenient and authentic source for lyrics. Often, you found new albums' lyrics there. Try to copy from there. They have a good way of presentation( at least better than MA - where you ought to find spelling mistakes, sentences not beginning with capitals, jumpled up paragraphs etc) too. Written by [user id=101272] on 21.03.2014 at 18:37 I checked out logs and saw it's you who added the lyrics citing MA source( which wasn't acceptable!). You got the perm I think and that's the only reason it added in database. The only thing you can legitimately peep in MA is over logos' issue(which half of the time solved by checking out on MySpace, official website or even on bandcamp).
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
I would trust more to MA lyrics as to their line up years (album line up) and also their demo bands and demo records .... but darklyrics are better I agree more trust
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
Written by [user id=101272] on Today at 01:00 Few errors? Woah, let me pour out for you. 1. Worst form of presentation. 2. Spelling mistakes, sentences starts with small letters and rectifying here one by one is time consuming and unnecessary. 3. They have loads of "????" in between and ultimately we(staff, elite, perm users) has to filled in with accurate words from reliable source(s). 4. Unnecessary use of !!! marks in the end of every sentence. 5. Incomplete ending( or specifically missing words). You saying a giant pool of fallacy, grossly inaccurate, poor information, misinterpreted facts webzine as a source should be accepted? Read the rules. In future, in whatever form MA source arrived in editing workshop, it'll be automatically rejected.
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| Lit. Account deleted |
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
Written by Bad English on 21.03.2014 at 21:20 Nope. If you come down from worse to the worst, I'll still say "wiki" is much better source than MA. I got an account on MA and only maintained to see how much errors they pile up. The site who has added rapper'a profile in database are contractual to many human errors. For line up stuff, better check Wiki or Myspace. They're much better.
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
Written by [user id=101272] on 21.03.2014 at 22:01 As long as it's not been sucked off from MA, it's fine enough(especially for me). If you really want to complete lyrics sheet, asformentioned, check out on their official website or on Darklyrics. Well, I got have to be dear and hunt for mistakes as long as I have perm. I don't allow unofficial sources whatsoever.
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
Written by Cynic Metalhead on 21.03.2014 at 22:07 I mean lyrics only !!!!!!!!!
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| Troy Killjoy perfunctionist Staff Posts: 21306  |
Written by [user id=101272] on 21.03.2014 at 21:29 Agreed, it's not any different pulling lyrics from MA as it is pulling from the other assortment of crappy lyrics sites. Most of them all just copy/paste from each other anyway - there aren't really any official lyrics sites aside from those posted on a band's official page. I think Cynic is overreacting a bit in regards to MA's credibility but that's just my opinion.
---- "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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| psykometal A staff guy... Elite Posts: 6101 |
Ok, apparently I missed a whole shit storm that blew up here. Lyrics is a different story since you can actually listen to the song to verify what your copy/pasting from other sites are legit (which I'm sure people like Lit. do). The "discreditation" of MA is regarding things like lineup, instruments, dates, etc. Stuff that you can't verify by simply listening to the song. Admittedly, when I wrote this up I neglected to consider lyrics among the things people might get from MA. My bad. Not sure if the "now some mod decided" crack was aimed at me, but I'm not the one who decided to discredit MA as an official source. Pretty sure that decision was made even before Troy's time as Database Manager. We just enforced the rule, and I'm the mope who decided to create an official thread to discuss it/ attempt to bring greater attention to it. Besides, by definition an official source means officially from the band or its label on behalf of the band. Since MA is not officially run by any of the bands or their labels, that means it is an unofficial source. So it's very nature as a database site run by fans discredits it as an official source for information. And FYI just like here on MS, if you try to submit edits to MA citing Metal Storm as your source, and a proper mod that gives a shit decides to assign it, they will also either reject it or ask for an official source before accepting it because we are just another unofficial database site run by fans. 
---- ~Zep, Database and Forum Moderation~
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| Cynic Metalhead Ambrish Saxena Posts: 7595 |
Written by Troy Killjoy on 22.03.2014 at 01:35 I'm not overreacting, Troy. It's just that I have seen too many flaws dragging from MA to our edits here. I've seen loads of mistakes in(particular) lyrics too while I was adding/editing or even checking out. How may I supposed to abort rules here and follow "credibility" of MA? Eh? Neither I've said anything about the credibility of MA site. I said they contain loads of fragmented information, distorted facts or even incorrect lyrics in their database. It's because lyrics are available on Metal Archive on first hand doesn't mean they're genuine or official. And neither Darklyrics is an official place for lyrics warehouse. However, i have seen guys who copy lyrics from band's official website and paste it in Darklyrics, so i tend to follow that site. Nothing else. Darklyrics does have too many errors but it's rectifiable.
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
Written by psykometal on 22.03.2014 at 04:12 have you tryd whit super brutal detah metal grows wlere it sounds liem ghahhaha ahhauhahha hgahghagga bllalaghahaha hjajjaja something like this  I have maybe 5-7 times accepted MA when I knbew 100% its good, (before read at official fb, ms news, even blaber or somehwere,) we had case some num nut eddit some bands new album, and one H before it I was news on bands facebook, he put credit at MA , I said him ''usually we dont accept MA, but since I saw news my self before it was good, I make exeption and accept''
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| Troy Killjoy perfunctionist Staff Posts: 21306 |
Written by Cynic Metalhead on 22.03.2014 at 08:26 You missed the point of what I said (and what Lex reiterated). Metal-Archives is a user-edited database just like ours, Spirit of Metal, Dark Lyrics, and pretty much any other site you can pull info from that isn't officially sanctioned by a band or label. Lyrics aren't usually uploaded in any kind of official capacity and most sites (including Metal-Archives) feature uploaded lyrics from users so it doesn't make sense to discredit Metal-Archives in that regard if you're going to accept lyrics from Dark Lyrics.
---- "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something."
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
Some bands try to upload lyrics in a bandcamp many bands had old home pages wht lyrics what are down Troy - defierence between MA and M are we permers and staff members confrirm changes what user do, MA no, only where they do it is RIP mussicans eddit , so .... and read a MA main page statment about line ups, seemns they coppy us
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| psykometal A staff guy... Elite Posts: 6101 |
Written by Bad English on 22.03.2014 at 16:59 Actually I believe they have a similar system as us wherein you just need enough community points. Major exception for us though, is we require users to get points in multiple fields to edit those fields. Whereas MA gives you access to the different fields as you earn enough main community points. They are just bigger and more well known than we are, so they have a lot more users who submit edits.
---- ~Zep, Database and Forum Moderation~
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
Written by psykometal on 23.03.2014 at 02:26 I have edditied line up, edd, deleted as split up, old , I have edd albums but its all, non request me any souce, only top RIP artist they asked source
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
And here we go again ''how legit is metal archives as source'' galadriel -- Mr Appen ... same error as in MA, we hade in MS this is what Dodo Date , band member asver me aout him .... band ansver this: Quote: so keep on using MA ... ehhhh
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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| Bad English Tage Westerlund Posts: 62135 |
Another example about MA sources Blindet Rain location was Paniklou...and such place dont exist in th Finland, I chacked whit 10 finnish users on facebook, here ... non and even wiki ever heard about such place .....so I send error report to MA another diferenece between fan edit date and ms style perm and staff accepting eddits datebase..... another example about legit sources as spyko told us to do
---- I stand whit Ukraine and Israel. They have right to defend own citizens. Stormtroopers of Death - "Speak English or Die" I better die, because I never will learn speek english, so I choose dieing
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