Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 06:02


People have a idyllic, distorted and false vision of the 80's. I was there and I can tell you that life wasn't any better than it is now. Things sucked as much as they suck today. I never longed for and I will never long for that time.

I'm going to be naughty and go completely off topic!

The 1980s were the last time the American middle class saw any improvement to real earnings or standard of living. It has been falling in real terms since whilst there's a growing percentage of people who are classified as poor. So for this group of people the 1980s were more idyllic than now.

Nothing to do with heavy metal so we now return to your scheduled heavy metal programming.

Don't know about 1980s but for me the 1990s really sucked for metal. Most shops didn't stock it, ordering it was horrifically expensive and it was hard to find out about new bands. The Nu-metal thing didn't appeal either. Things got better in 2000s with extensive internet coverage and a resurgence of interest in more traditional forms of heavy metal.

People are really spoiled for choice these days!

Written by Spirit of dead on 29.01.2016 at 06:28

Don't know about 1980s but for me the 1990s really sucked for metal. Most shops didn't stock it, ordering it was horrifically expensive and it was hard to find out about new bands.

I know what you mean. It wasn't exactly great here in Canada in the 90's. But it was worse in the 80's.
Now, the music stores are basically dead here. I can't even remember the last time I bought a CD in stores. I don't care, however. I've been buying all my stuff online for years. Considering the kind of music I'm listening to, most albums were never available in stores anyway.
I'm one of those who still like to have a physical CD. I don't download anything and I'm buying my stuff in a perfectly legal way but you have to live with the times. Stores belong to the past.

Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 06:40



I know what you mean. It wasn't exactly great here in Canada in the 90's. But it was worse in the 80's.
Now, the music stores are basically dead here. I can't even remember the last time I bought a CD in stores. I don't care, however. I've been buying all my stuff online for years. Considering the kind of music I'm listening to, most albums were never available in stores anyway.
I'm one of those who still like to have a physical CD. I don't download anything and I'm buying my stuff in a perfectly legal way but you have to live with the times. Stores belong to the past.

Yup, i'm the same way, especially when most stores charge more than what you would buy online including shipping.

Written by [user id=136611] on 29.01.2016 at 06:50

Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 06:40



I know what you mean. It wasn't exactly great here in Canada in the 90's. But it was worse in the 80's.
Now, the music stores are basically dead here. I can't even remember the last time I bought a CD in stores. I don't care, however. I've been buying all my stuff online for years. Considering the kind of music I'm listening to, most albums were never available in stores anyway.
I'm one of those who still like to have a physical CD. I don't download anything and I'm buying my stuff in a perfectly legal way but you have to live with the times. Stores belong to the past.

Yup, i'm the same way, especially when most stores charge more than what you would buy online including shipping.

My main problem with stores here is the availability. They don't have much choice, unless you stick to popular bands. I would have to order the albums. But ordering in stores is much longer than buying directly on the internet myself, and more expensive. There is absolutely no reason to shop for underground Metal albums in stores.

Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 06:57



My main problem with stores here is the availability. They don't have much choice, unless you stick to popular bands. I would have to order the albums. But ordering in stores is much longer than buying directly on the internet myself, and more expensive. There is absolutely no reason to shop for underground Metal albums in stores.

Yeah well that's if what i'm looking for is even there, which is very unlikely. I think the most underground album i have seen my local is a recent Shining album.

Oh yeah and forget ordering through a store, what a waste of time and money!

I still buy from stores sometimes (e.g. new Megadeth) but mostly it's online due to availability.

There's a real pleasure to going to a record shop and having all those CDs in front of you and then dropping $200-$300 on CDs in a single hit. Ultimate in retail therapy and much better than ordering online!

Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 06:02


People have a idyllic, distorted and false vision of the 80's. I was there and I can tell you that life wasn't any better than it is now. Things sucked as much as they suck today. I never longed for and I will never long for that time.

I still had all my fingers in 1986...

Written by M C Vice on 29.01.2016 at 07:41


I still had all my fingers in 1986...

What happened to your fingers?

Written by Spirit of dead on 29.01.2016 at 07:18

I still buy from stores sometimes (e.g. new Megadeth) but mostly it's online due to availability.

There's a real pleasure to going to a record shop and having all those CDs in front of you and then dropping $200-$300 on CDs in a single hit. Ultimate in retail therapy and much better than ordering online!

Yeah its real fun scrolling through a hundred cds and finding nothing.

I myself quite like the excitement of driving home from work knowing a little present might be waiting for me.

Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 06:02

Written by Karlabos on 20.01.2016 at 13:41

I wonder what will the old time 'heavy metal' fans will do after all the 80s bands stop working, will they just keep listening to the old records over and over again? Will they stop listening to metal and begin following mainstream media music? Will they finally give up on the 80s and acknowledge the existence of modern metal?

People have a idyllic, distorted and false vision of the 80's. I was there and I can tell you that life wasn't any better than it is now. Things sucked as much as they suck today. I never longed for and I will never long for that time.

And for a metalhead living here in a small area, things sucked much more in the 80's. I mean, now all I have to do is to turn on my computer and I can find and order all the music I want. In the 80's, it was a pain in the ass to look for new stuff.

I think those who think that Metal is dying are those people who can't look past the old bands and traditional Heavy Metal. You know, those annoying people who think that only old Metal is good and everything since the 90's sucks. If they think like that, it's their own problem. All the old bands will soon be gone. If they can't realize that there is still new awesome albums to listen to, then they only have to listen to their old records or stop listening to Metal, I couldn't care less. Again, it's their problem.

I pretty much agree with everything you said. (except the party bit, I have nothing against themed parties =p)
And yeah, nostalgia is the main reason why 80s big bands are worshipped, I think. Let's say, there are bands similar to Sabbath now and also there were similar to them back on the 80s. People will never recognize the ones playing now, because they are justwannabes, copying what the almighty ones did. They also won't recognze the more underground ones from the 80s, because since they weren't covered from media at the time, they must be "quality inferior" (but it's all doom metal, it's all the same). In the end there never will be a doom metal as "good" as Sabbath because they either will get hated because they are not original enough, not famous enough or not born on the 80s enough.

And people will keep listening to the old classics over and over again, not even because of quality, but because of what they "meant" on the 80s. yes, they were perhaps revolutionary, but nowadays? Just an "above average" release at most. And people who weren' even there seem to have the nostalgia too. That's because they probably were introduced to metal by those "classics" since they are the most known metal bands after all, and then they aren't able to get the same feeling of the new releases compared to what they felt on the first time and get all "oh, that totally worn-up classic from 10 years before I was born is the best album ever, nothing compares."

The 3 paragraphes I left when I quoted you are the most true: The 80s also "sucked" for music as today (on a mainstream level, I say. both were amazing on an underground level) But nowadays people have filtered only the actual good ones from the 80s and remember only those. had they take the time to browse some obscure 80s stuff they'd see how much crap was released at that time too. and how much good stuff were overlooked. just like nowadays.
AAnd the part where you say that in the 80s you couldn't find music for your life, yes. That's true. Internet got a bit late here where I live, so I know the pain. Nowadays it's faaar too better, just because of that alone.

Anyway, well.. Let the people blind by nostalgia stay blind. I am going to keep looking for some more awesome music. From the 80s, 90s, 0s or the 10s =]

Written by BitterCOld on 28.01.2016 at 20:12

See M C Vice's prior post.

Demand isn't down.

Willingness to pay for it is (aside from Marcel and the vinyl tribe) ...

If demand isn't down then why aren't modern metal bands selling out arenas like the old classics are? Amon Amarth, arguably the most recognizable/popular modern metal act still goes on club tours in the US while the older bands continue to fill up stadiums around the world. Also, other music genres continue to burst into the mainstream despite the fact that music sales are down across the board, regardless of specific genre. How do you explain all this?

Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 06:02


Lots and lots of people are stuck in the 80's. Not only in relation to music but with many many things. For example, a guy organized some kind of tour here recently. It was called 80's something (I don't remember the name exactly and it was in French). People dressed like they did in the 80's, with the haircut, spraynet and all. They listened only to 80's music, watched 80's shows, etc, etc.

I find this kind of thing sad and pathetic. Get over it people: the 80's are over! It's even totally ridiculous at times because some people who worship the 80's weren't even born back then. Some people call this kind of attitude nostalgia. I call it refusing change and failure to live with your time.

People have a idyllic, distorted and false vision of the 80's. I was there and I can tell you that life wasn't any better than it is now. Things sucked as much as they suck today. I never longed for and I will never long for that time.

Jeese, so many 80's haters out here rn lol.

I listen to mostly modern metal but I'm still an 80's lover. I love the look, style, attitudes, the music, the movies, personalities, the cheese, all of it. It's no different than people being into Civil War Re-enactments, being into the Victorian Era, Middle Ages, Renaissance, Colonial Times, 1920's, 1950's etc. It's not about 'how much better those times were' and more about being immersed and enjoying the aesthetics of a time period and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. That's just my take on it though, I know there are the obnoxious 80's lovers out there as well.

Written by Karlabos on 29.01.2016 at 14:42

I pretty much agree with everything you said. (except the party bit, I have nothing against themed parties =p)
And yeah, nostalgia is the main reason why 80s big bands are worshipped, I think. Let's say, there are bands similar to Sabbath now and also there were similar to them back on the 80s. People will never recognize the ones playing now, because they are justwannabes, copying what the almighty ones did. They also won't recognze the more underground ones from the 80s, because since they weren't covered from media at the time, they must be "quality inferior" (but it's all doom metal, it's all the same). In the end there never will be a doom metal as "good" as Sabbath because they either will get hated because they are not original enough, not famous enough or not born on the 80s enough.

And people will keep listening to the old classics over and over again, not even because of quality, but because of what they "meant" on the 80s. yes, they were perhaps revolutionary, but nowadays? Just an "above average" release at most. And people who weren' even there seem to have the nostalgia too. That's because they probably were introduced to metal by those "classics" since they are the most known metal bands after all, and then they aren't able to get the same feeling of the new releases compared to what they felt on the first time and get all "oh, that totally worn-up classic from 10 years before I was born is the best album ever, nothing compares."

The 3 paragraphes I left when I quoted you are the most true: The 80s also "sucked" for music as today (on a mainstream level, I say. both were amazing on an underground level) But nowadays people have filtered only the actual good ones from the 80s and remember only those. had they take the time to browse some obscure 80s stuff they'd see how much crap was released at that time too. and how much good stuff were overlooked. just like nowadays.
AAnd the part where you say that in the 80s you couldn't find music for your life, yes. That's true. Internet got a bit late here where I live, so I know the pain. Nowadays it's faaar too better, just because of that alone.

Anyway, well.. Let the people blind by nostalgia stay blind. I am going to keep looking for some more awesome music. From the 80s, 90s, 0s or the 10s =]

When I said that thing about parties, I said that I find it pathetic and sad. I need to clarify it. I have nothing against remembering the past and having fun with old stuff from time to time. It's the bitter nostalgia of some people that I find sad and I dislike. You know, some people really wish that it would still be like that every day and feel sad because it is not like that anymore. They would want to stop change and evolution, which is impossible. It is unrealistic.

And while I can understand nostalgia to a certain extent, the problem is most of the time it distorts perception and lead people to remember things incorrectly and see the past through pink-tainted glasses. And it leads to another problem: it makes people see the present worse than it really is.

About albums being "classic": again, there is sometimes a false perception about many albums and bands, a difference between what some people now believe they were in the 80's and what they really were back then. Some albums were definitely considered as masterpieces back then and still deserve this title today. However, some albums that are now considered "classics", "legendary" or "hidden 80's gems" by some people were not regarded highly in the 80's or went pretty much unnoticed. Some albums and bands who were nothing more than second-rate or third-tier back then are now considered as highly influential and classic. Marcel mentioned it many times on this forum and I totally agree. It is true that sometimes the same things are perceived very differently and there's a gap between what people believe today and what really happened back then.

When it comes to Metal music, I think it is impossible to deny that, generally speaking, Metal is more technical today than in the 80's. It is often more complex, tight and instrumentally demanding. Metal was more "in progress" in the 80's and often a bit sloppy.

As for mainstream music, I don't know if it was better or worse than it is now. I stopped paying attention to mainstream music when I was still in my teenage years. I can tell that the 80's were very cheesy in general (not only music but looks, etc...). Some people consider it as the cheesiest decade ever. I don't know.

I listen to Metal from the 80's, 90's, 00's and the present decade. I think there is great music from all those periods. People who stubbornly stick to the 80's are missing a lot, IMO.
As for the future of Metal, I believe (and I'm not saying this because I love extreme Metal) that the scene will become smaller with time and more limited to extreme Metal. Mainstream Metal will decline with the departure of the old bands.

Written by AngelofDeth on 29.01.2016 at 22:03

Jeese, so many 80's haters out here rn lol.

I listen to mostly modern metal but I'm still an 80's lover. I love the look, style, attitudes, the music, the movies, personalities, the cheese, all of it. It's no different than people being into Civil War Re-enactments, being into the Victorian Era, Middle Ages, Renaissance, Colonial Times, 1920's, 1950's etc. It's not about 'how much better those times were' and more about being immersed and enjoying the aesthetics of a time period and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. That's just my take on it though, I know there are the obnoxious 80's lovers out there as well.

I know you intend it as a joke, but I'm not a hater. I had a very normal and happy childhood and teenage years. To tell the truth, the 90's were much harder for me than the 80's. I only wished to mention how some people are unrealistic when it comes to the 80's (the 80's lovers you mentioned).

By the way, I agree with pretty much everything you said in the beginning of this thread.

Written by [user id=136611] on 29.01.2016 at 11:18


Yeah its real fun scrolling through a hundred cds and finding nothing.

I myself quite like the excitement of driving home from work knowing a little present might be waiting for me.

I usually find a crap load of back catalogue stuff or new releases I might not have considered previously. I've only got 400 CDs so there's still a lot of stuff missing in my collection.

With online orders I get anxious cause I have to pay before I get the goods and I don't trust many online stores or the postal services.

Written by Lord_Regnier on 29.01.2016 at 22:39


I know you intend it as a joke, but I'm not a hater. I had a very normal and happy childhood and teenage years. To tell the truth, the 90's were much harder for me than the 80's. I only wished to mention how some people are unrealistic when it comes to the 80's (the 80's lovers you mentioned).

By the way, I agree with pretty much everything you said in the beginning of this thread.

Yes, just poking fun a bit. Seemed like everyone jumped on the 80's hate bandwagon but I understand the frustration when people claim some bygone era was so much better when every era has pros/cons. I love the 80's but now isn't too bad either and arguably even better metal-wise.

Thanks! Lot's of good discussion here.

Written by AngelofDeth on 29.01.2016 at 23:24

Seemed like everyone jumped on the 80's hate bandwagon but I understand the frustration when people claim some bygone era was so much better when every era has pros/cons. I love the 80's but now isn't too bad either and arguably even better metal-wise.

You can also see the opposite attitude. People who think that "Metal sucked in the 80's" and "only extreme Metal is good and deserves to be called Metal".
I don't like this attitude either. Same kind of elitism, only the other way around. But I think they are not bitter and frustrated like those stuck in the 80's.

Written by Spirit of dead on 29.01.2016 at 22:48

With online orders I get anxious cause I have to pay before I get the goods and I don't trust many online stores or the postal services.

I was afraid of buying online at first but I can tell you that I've been buying stuff online for years and I never lost a penny. I always check how the seller is rated and buy from sellers rated over 90% (based on lots of transactions, if possible). If you're careful and use your brain, there's no reason to loose money. The worst that can happen is an order to be cancelled but you don't lose money. Using Paypal is also a good idea, as it provides a better protection.

Written by [user id=136611] on 29.01.2016 at 11:18

Written by Spirit of dead on 29.01.2016 at 07:18

I still buy from stores sometimes (e.g. new Megadeth) but mostly it's online due to availability.

There's a real pleasure to going to a record shop and having all those CDs in front of you and then dropping $200-$300 on CDs in a single hit. Ultimate in retail therapy and much better than ordering online!

Yeah its real fun scrolling through a hundred cds and finding nothing.

I myself quite like the excitement of driving home from work knowing a little present might be waiting for me.

But then there's the disappointment that it hasn't arrived yet.

Written by Spirit of dead on 29.01.2016 at 22:48

Written by [user id=136611] on 29.01.2016 at 11:18


Yeah its real fun scrolling through a hundred cds and finding nothing.

I myself quite like the excitement of driving home from work knowing a little present might be waiting for me.

I usually find a crap load of back catalogue stuff or new releases I might not have considered previously. I've only got 400 CDs so there's still a lot of stuff missing in my collection.

With online orders I get anxious cause I have to pay before I get the goods and I don't trust many online stores or the postal services.

Amazon's reliable, and decently priced (the outside sellers on Amazon charge a lot more for postage, though). Bandcamp's generally reliable, too, but takes a lot longer to arrive. But they usually give you a free download with cd purchases.

Written by Spirit of dead on 29.01.2016 at 07:44

Written by M C Vice on 29.01.2016 at 07:41


I still had all my fingers in 1986...

What happened to your fingers?

Had 1 removed in 87. Now I've only got 10 (9 of which work properly)

Written by M C Vice on 30.01.2016 at 02:18


Amazon's reliable, and decently priced (the outside sellers on Amazon charge a lot more for postage, though). Bandcamp's generally reliable, too, but takes a lot longer to arrive. But they usually give you a free download with cd purchases.

Thanks about the advice

I do order on line. But I'm a paranoid git by nature so never trust an order will get there until it's in my hands.

Quote:

Had 1 removed in 87. Now I've only got 10 (9 of which work properly)

Ouch!

Written by Spirit of dead on 29.01.2016 at 22:48



I usually find a crap load of back catalogue stuff or new releases I might not have considered previously. I've only got 400 CDs so there's still a lot of stuff missing in my collection.

With online orders I get anxious cause I have to pay before I get the goods and I don't trust many online stores or the postal services.

Well i only have about 30 cds in the metal genre and still can'y find shit, i suppose it depends on what your looking for and how good your record store is. I only know of one good record store in nz and even then it takes a lot of searching to finally find something.

I have never had an item not turn up eventually when ordered.

.......anyway, waaaaaaay off topic!

Written by [user id=136611] on 30.01.2016 at 05:59


.......anyway, waaaaaaay off topic!

Nah, this is still kinda on topic. The availability, or lack of, would affect a genre's popularity to a certain extent.

^What Che said in the last page. People need to fucking look harder.

Written by 3rdWorld on 30.01.2016 at 13:41

^What Che said in the last page. People need to fucking look harder.

Look harder for what?

Written by M C Vice on 30.01.2016 at 11:22

Written by [user id=136611] on 30.01.2016 at 05:59


.......anyway, waaaaaaay off topic!

Nah, this is still kinda on topic. The availability, or lack of, would affect a genre's popularity to a certain extent.

Very true.

I think if mainstream metal goes, there is one less gateway for new fans. And that's a huge gateway. How many of us got into metal via Metallica, Korn, System Of A Down, Slipknot, Trivium, Lamb of God etc?

Written by Spirit of dead on 31.01.2016 at 00:54



I think if mainstream metal goes, there is one less gateway for new fans. And that's a huge gateway. How many of us got into metal via Metallica, Korn, System Of A Down, Slipknot, Trivium, Lamb of God etc?

Not a single person from my generation

Never got into any of those bands myself

Well, I listened to a Korn album... once.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 31.01.2016 at 04:36



Not a single person from my generation

Were any of the guys from Trivium even born when you got into metal?