Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.

i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

This is clearly going to break out into a metal civil war. The young against the old. I'm 23, what side am I on? Can i be young please?

Written by -tom- on 01.03.2011 at 00:38

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.

i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

This is clearly going to break out into a metal civil war. The young against the old. I'm 23, what side am I on? Can i be young please?

Ah that's given me a great idea for a story, you could have Melodic, Extreme and Alternative factions fighting eachother!

Written by -tom- on 01.03.2011 at 00:38

This is clearly going to break out into a metal civil war. The young against the old. I'm 23, what side am I on? Can i be young please?

Then I will chose the side of old....Because old school stuff rock...OK here and there there are exceptions....

Written by BitterCOld on 01.03.2011 at 00:33

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.

i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

what we have learned from this thread is metal is only for twentysomethings who take it SERIOUSLY and watch their shows sober and standing in place, arms crossed.

Do tell me, what is the point of getting so hammered at shows that you barely know where you are? Are you there to see the band, or to unleash your inner caveman by moshing the fuck out of the crowd? I mosh too, but some people really take it to the extreme. I'm not there to beat up on people, I want to see and hear the damn band.
If you just want to get drunk, go to a party, or a bar, or simply stay at home and intoxicate yourself to your heart's desire.
You say you enjoy the show even more by moshing and drinking, but to me it sounds like you enjoy moshing and drinking, and not the show. Sorry if I'm wrong.

There are many ways to enjoy a gig, and you'd have to be pretty dumb to begrudge any. But respect goes both ways, and everybody should remember moderation. If you want to stand and listen, you probably shouldn't stand at the center-frontish of the floor where the pit will happen. And if you want to mosh, stick to that small area with people who're into it, and don't start pushing people who're not into it. And for crying out loud, leave the first few rows for people who like to stay put.

Personally, I like to get a little lively and feel the moment, but I don't run around in circle pits or shove people around. Probably because I have glasses, and because it's just not very interesting. I wish people would know proper etiquette and leave eachother alone. Ultimately though, the scales weigh in favor of the standstills due to the simple fact that pushing strangers around without their consent is, well, illegal. But yeah, you should expect some scuffle if you go to a thrash or death metal gig and stand around the center floor.

Written by IronAngel on 01.03.2011 at 12:43

There are many ways to enjoy a gig, and you'd have to be pretty dumb to begrudge any. But respect goes both ways, and everybody should remember moderation. If you want to stand and listen, you probably shouldn't stand at the center-frontish of the floor where the pit will happen. And if you want to mosh, stick to that small area with people who're into it, and don't start pushing people who're not into it. And for crying out loud, leave the first few rows for people who like to stay put.

Personally, I like to get a little lively and feel the moment, but I don't run around in circle pits or shove people around. Probably because I have glasses, and because it's just not very interesting. I wish people would know proper etiquette and leave eachother alone. Ultimately though, the scales weigh in favor of the standstills due to the simple fact that pushing strangers around without their consent is, well, illegal. But yeah, you should expect some scuffle if you go to a thrash or death metal gig and stand around the center floor.

Just like I've written this. But I'm a girl and I used to have piercings, so I freak out when I see a mosh pit. There haven't been any accidents, thank God...

Well maybe Im young , but I belong to old generation, old school metalhead , I hardly use cell pfone, moden techologies, ok i net is i net its only one what I need to live, otherway I lile in past still live and hate every single change

Written by -tom- on 28.02.2011 at 23:35

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

I must say that I've encountered such people as preteens that have the gothic justin bieber look and are very noisy and anoying.
On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

That sounds like an ideal gig. Everyone should be jumping around and moshing. Hate it when i go to gigs where the crowd doesn't seem to care if the band are playing.

It's ok and fun to jump around and mosh, but not when the guy behind you is drunk and can vomit or fall over you...

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.

i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

As I said, fun to jump, mosh and even drink. I just don't want to get vomit all over me.

No moshing and jumping when drinking. And here it's the youngsters that can't handle their booze and throw up. Old people just get drunk and fall asleep at worst and only throw up the next day. It's the youngsters that are a nuisance at live gigs. Moshing to music you can't mosh to. Moshing right in front of the bar. Bumping into everyone. There is a place and time to mosh and that is not in the back of the venue and also not right up front in front of the stage.

Written by Slayer666 on 01.03.2011 at 11:46

Do tell me, what is the point of getting so hammered at shows that you barely know where you are? Are you there to see the band, or to unleash your inner caveman by moshing the fuck out of the crowd? I mosh too, but some people really take it to the extreme. I'm not there to beat up on people, I want to see and hear the damn band.
If you just want to get drunk, go to a party, or a bar, or simply stay at home and intoxicate yourself to your heart's desire.
You say you enjoy the show even more by moshing and drinking, but to me it sounds like you enjoy moshing and drinking, and not the show. Sorry if I'm wrong.

Very few people take it to this extreme. Usually, the arseholes are the one's that stand around the edge of the pit and kick out at people. Fuck that shit!

I go clubbing and shout along to songs and dance as well. It's not purely about the music. I don't go clubbing to hear Lady Gaga. I go clubbing to dance and shout along to Lady Gaga.

Hope that example clears it up a bit. No one's forcing anyone else to mosh or to dance or to shout along. You know where the pit's going to be. It's not hard to avoid.

Also, in years of gigging and clubbing, I've never puked. I don't get wasted. I don't hassle people. I have a good time.

Written by Slayer666 on 01.03.2011 at 11:46

Written by BitterCOld on 01.03.2011 at 00:33

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.

i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

what we have learned from this thread is metal is only for twentysomethings who take it SERIOUSLY and watch their shows sober and standing in place, arms crossed.

Do tell me, what is the point of getting so hammered at shows that you barely know where you are? Are you there to see the band, or to unleash your inner caveman by moshing the fuck out of the crowd? I mosh too, but some people really take it to the extreme. I'm not there to beat up on people, I want to see and hear the damn band.
If you just want to get drunk, go to a party, or a bar, or simply stay at home and intoxicate yourself to your heart's desire.
You say you enjoy the show even more by moshing and drinking, but to me it sounds like you enjoy moshing and drinking, and not the show. Sorry if I'm wrong.

yes, you are wrong.

i don't get stupid drunk, but i have drinks. and audiences in american and euro shows are different. we are more, uh, demonstrative. when you get closer to the stage it's a bunch of moshing and jostling. don't like it, stay the fuck back. those who participate do so willingly.

when catching an upbeat show (dm/thrash/bm) i'll take the more visceral pushing and shoving over standing in place. and for what it's worth, the bands feed off that energy and encourage. go visit "get thrashed' and listen to Exodus and Violence talk about the crowds. Slayer used to have big ass rugby looking dudes with cameras built into little helmets run through the pits to capture some of the action first hand in the pit... then put that video into their Live Intrusion vid.

Yeah I think the most annoying thing is those who are drinking yet moshing at the same time, just no need for it and it can cause accidents in some cases which aren't pleasant for some people who may not have wanted to even be involved in the first place. I can't say I like the new scene of metalheads generally speaking mainly because where as we and older generations know about the history and formation of sub genres where as the younger ones are losing that knowledge with each generation it seems.
If I go to a gig I like to watch and listen and I'll do it at a distance so that those who want to go mad can do so, maybe have a drink but not too much as I like to remember as much detail of the performance as possible.
Back in my alcoholocausting days I can't recall being overly stupid in my actions over than one time when there was a fairly quiet gig and I was a bit bored of peoples lack of enthusiasm so I literally shoved people into the front so we could create a circle pit which was amusing but it didn't take my long to realise that's not the greatest thing to do necessarily, especially as a female, I think a lot of females in metal shouldn't be behaving too outwardly male-like frankly but that's just my opinion.

Written by [user id=24216] on 01.03.2011 at 19:22

Yeah I think the most annoying thing is those who are drinking yet moshing at the same time, just no need for it and it can cause accidents in some cases which aren't pleasant for some people who may not have wanted to even be involved in the first place. I can't say I like the new scene of metalheads generally speaking mainly because where as we and older generations know about the history and formation of sub genres where as the younger ones are losing that knowledge with each generation it seems.
If I go to a gig I like to watch and listen and I'll do it at a distance so that those who want to go mad can do so, maybe have a drink but not too much as I like to remember as much detail of the performance as possible.
Back in my alcoholocausting days I can't recall being overly stupid in my actions over than one time when there was a fairly quiet gig and I was a bit bored of peoples lack of enthusiasm so I literally shoved people into the front so we could create a circle pit which was amusing but it didn't take my long to realise that's not the greatest thing to do necessarily, especially as a female, I think a lot of females in metal shouldn't be behaving too outwardly male-like frankly but that's just my opinion.

You consider yourself the old generation? Your only a year old than me...I don't wanna be old! I think it has less to do with "forgetting" the origin of shit, but rather they haven't learnt it yet. As I believe another person in this thread stated; we weren't all born clutching a copy of Master Of Puppets.

I think there's always been the "new generation kids", for example in the early 90s there were probably kids who were looked down upon by people who grew up in the 80s because of them listening to Metallica's self-titled and Anthrax's The Sound of Killer B's instead of Ride the Lightning and Spreading the Disease, and think it's the heaviest thing ever. you can clear as hell see the analogy with many of the youngest metalheads of today which you see at gigs, many younger metalheads would give you a blank stare if you, to give an example of a newer band, ask for their favorite song off of In Flames' "Jester Race" when in fact they only listened to a few tracks from Come Clarity and their latest.

or maybe they would go to Slayer shows(because that's where all the cool misunderstood brutal guys go to right?) where they would try and look so goddamned brutal with their spiky wristbands and manly incipent facial hair but suceed only in puking their brains out after they've had 3 shots of jager and the cheap liquor they bought from a supermarket with money from their grandmother(which they told her they would buy schoolbooks with) and drank before they entered the venue.

we've all been in a similar situation at one point, sooner or later everyone wakes up and either gets over this "metal phase" or goes deeper into the scene.

also, let's not forget we're not all immune to this mentality: when you're 15 and you just barely discovered metal, you try and find a place for yourself in this social group, you seek approval from this group whether you realize/want it or not. you want to be brutal and so many of these teens go to see bands and look cool and get the "seal of approval", as in, you want the metal group to accept you and tell you "yeah man, you indeed are fucking brutal".

so they act as tough and brutal as possible according to the current trends(in the 80s it was moshing during a Slayer show, now it seems it's hardcore dancing to Attack Attack for deathcore kids or standing around with corpsepaint on your face, arms folded and a grumpy expression, looking evil as hell, for black metal), and of course drink and puke their intestines out in many cases. none of this surprises me, because i admit i was in a similar situation at one point, and if someone wants to reply to this post i'm gonna ask first: do YOU remember when you were 15? were you a mature genius? or did you also drink way over your limit and act like an idiot at concerts? let's be honest here people...

Testosterone and Elitism. Fuck Yeah!!!

Ah man, if I stand anywhere it has to be to the outside with my arms cross. Not that I am being a judgmental douche or something. I have a cardiac pacemaker and cannot get involved with the crowd. I wish I could. But me being there, paying for the ticket, and enjoying the show in the only way I can should suffice the band enough. I am 27... just so you guys know. Not 60.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.
i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

Nah... I doubt she meant to say that you can't enjoy the gig the way you want (I know that since she's my sis after all and i've been in a couple of concerts with her). She msotly meant the dudes that make trouble like vomit, fight, that kind of thing... You explained it well in the later comment though, there's a place for everything and I also believe that it's mostly the young ones who end up fighting and vomiting.

Written by Valentin B on 02.03.2011 at 01:07


also, let's not forget we're not all immune to this mentality: when you're 15 and you just barely discovered metal, you try and find a place for yourself in this social group, you seek approval from this group whether you realize/want it or not. you want to be brutal and so many of these teens go to see bands and look cool and get the "seal of approval", as in, you want the metal group to accept you and tell you "yeah man, you indeed are fucking brutal".

so they act as tough and brutal as possible according to the current trends(in the 80s it was moshing during a Slayer show, now it seems it's hardcore dancing to Attack Attack for deathcore kids or standing around with corpsepaint on your face, arms folded and a grumpy expression, looking evil as hell, for black metal), and of course drink and puke their intestines out in many cases. none of this surprises me, because i admit i was in a similar situation at one point, and if someone wants to reply to this post i'm gonna ask first: do YOU remember when you were 15? were you a mature genius? or did you also drink way over your limit and act like an idiot at concerts? let's be honest here people...

Yeah, I do remember when I was 15. It was only 'bout a year ago. Can't say I was a "mature genius", but I sure as hell didn't drink over my limit at shows to get the seal of approval. I started listening to metal when I was 10. Not once did I feel any sort of a need to find some special kind of social group that will value and accept me solely based on the kind of music I listen to, or the way I act at shows. I have 2 friends that are into metal. I go to shows with them (as rarely as that is), and hang out with other, non-metal head kids from school or neighborhood. And I never even so much as smell booze, or any other psycho-active supstance at shows. Why? Because I don't need it to enjoy them. Oh, and because when I drink I get too friendly and loving, so I would probably propose to the nearest chick in the crowd.
In fact, I stay away as far away as possible from the so-called "metal heads" my age, just because of the sheep mentality. Oh, yeah, metal is supposed to be all about freedom, individualism and stuff, right? My dick it is. I don't know about older metal heads, but teen metal heads (that I personally know) have just the same kind of trend-hoping mentality as all of those people that they "hate" so much. I'd rather chop my own arm off with a piece of blunt, rusty metal than hang around people like that, let alone seek their approval.
My point is, there is very little justification for such behaving. Not that it bothers me much, though, nor do I pay much attention to it. After all, everyone should mind their own business. It's just my 2 cents.

Written by Slayer666 on 02.03.2011 at 20:22

My point is, there is very little justification for such behaving. Not that it bothers me much, though, nor do I pay much attention to it. After all, everyone should mind their own business. It's just my 2 cents.

yeah man, i agree with you, it seems many kids these days don't know what the fuck they're doing, but it's nice to see other metalheads that take music and concerts seriously and don't succumb to such shallow low points like drinking to look as brutal as possible but in reality being annoying retards. but then again what you can do aside from shoving them away and scream SLAAAAAAAYEEERRRRR




try and deny you didn't feel happy in some way from reading that first sentence. even if you don't go to concerts to drink until you can't tell your dick from your ear and to vomit on people in the moshpit at a Caliban show, there are other ways to seek approval. my post wasn't meant to be taken 100% literally. subconsciously or not, we ALL need to belong to a group, from the retarded kid in the corner to the high-school fashion princess.

it's most clear when dealing with concrete examples, so i'm not accusing you of anything here, but check this out: your username and display image scream typical metalhead to the maximum, and you replied to my post to tell me you don't seek approval even though i wasn't directing this post to you. i'm 99% sure it's because subconsciously you wanted to see other people agree with you. i repeat this DOES NOT mean i'm trying to condescend you or accuse you of stuff, i'm only trying to prove a point here, and that's exactly the reason why many teenagers in the metal scene act the way they do.

Written by Valentin B on 02.03.2011 at 20:46

Written by Slayer666 on 02.03.2011 at 20:22

My point is, there is very little justification for such behaving. Not that it bothers me much, though, nor do I pay much attention to it. After all, everyone should mind their own business. It's just my 2 cents.

it's most clear when dealing with concrete examples, so i'm not accusing you of anything here, but check this out: your username and display image scream typical metalhead to the maximum, and you replied to my post to tell me you don't seek approval even though i wasn't directing this post to you. i'm 99% sure it's because subconsciously you wanted to see other people agree with you. i repeat this DOES NOT mean i'm trying to condescend you or accuse you of stuff, i'm only trying to prove a point here, and that's exactly the reason why many teenagers in the metal scene act the way they do.

Looks like I'll be haunted by the poor choice of my username forever.
The username and display image were chosen that way mostly due to the lack of imagination than anything else. Now I just don't want to bother changing it, and there is some nostalgia in there.
I replied to your post because it kinda pisses me off when people use the "it's OK if he's an idiot, he's only 15" line. Unless you're mentally handicapped, in my book age is not an excuse, nor it should be. It seems people suffer from the "Peter Pan" syndrome nowadays, when women at the age of 30 still consider themselves young girls, and it's OK to be an immature prick at the age of 15. A guy that's 17 is still considered a kid. Fucking bullshit. Back in older times, a 15-16 year old would have a family of his own and would have to work for his bread. I'm not saying I'd want those times to return, but if a teenager could be mature and responsible back then, why can't he be now?
EDIT: I swear to you I did not feel happy in any way after reading that sentence. If you agree with me, that's cool. If not, it's still cool.

Written by [user id=109947] on 02.03.2011 at 05:16

Testosterone and Elitism. Fuck Yeah!!!

Yeah that pretty much sums this up.

Unless there are like massive amounts, how can anyone be so bothered about what other people are doing at a gig? :s that completely astounds me. It's like, you go to the gig to do your thing, enjoy the music, mosh, get wasted, high, meet chicks/guys whatever. Why are you so bothered by what other people are doing? Lol.

Someone mentioned people who constantly mosh...fair enough, but people who mosh have designated 'moshing areas', it's not like them moshing is causing little chain reactions within the crowd .I personally love moshing, of course it depends on the tempo of the song, but the physical activity and sheer rush are incredible! If I was one of the people you're talking about, why should I sacrifice my entertainment for yours?

Written by X-Ray Rod on 02.03.2011 at 19:14

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 00:10

Written by Coté on 28.02.2011 at 21:17

On the other hand I've met older guys, with older I mean 30-35 years old that go to the gigs just to get drunk and try to sing along and jump without falling. I think that's just pathetic, I mean go to a fricking bar damn it!, don't spoil the experience for the rest of us that want to hear and appreciate the music.

So us older guys are not allowed to enjoy gigs the way we want?
You know what's annoying? Those sober under 30 year old kids that think the floor is all their's cause they are not as drunk as us old old guys and gals.
i am sure we as drunk as we are appreciate the music and live gig more than you youngsters do (yes, his sounds stupid so did what you just said)

Nah... I doubt she meant to say that you can't enjoy the gig the way you want (I know that since she's my sis after all and i've been in a couple of concerts with her). She msotly meant the dudes that make trouble like vomit, fight, that kind of thing... You explained it well in the later comment though, there's a place for everything and I also believe that it's mostly the young ones who end up fighting and vomiting.

I meant exactly that. And I don't think that what I said sounded stupid, I just expressed myself in the wrong way. Anyway if I ofended anybody, it wans't my porpouse.

I have a lot more tolerance for cluelessness in the young. They haven't been through it before.

When I see some dude who's 35, drunk off his ass and doing stupid things that prevent others from enjoying the show, I'm inclined to think he's a retard. (Note: I work in a eugenics lab, euthanizing retarded people all day long. It's true that Down's syndrome patients twitch differently, and even their death rattles sound "retarded." But I digress.)

That being said, 90% of our species are douchebags, even in relatively nice places like the Europe and the USA. Most of those Justin Bieber kids are going to be just as fucking clueless when they're 58 as when they're 14. Sad but true.

I've been a huge fan of the music for many years Thought you guys
might enjoy this too, former drummer of SOAD and vocalist of APEX THEORY's
new band called KILLMATRIARCH ...dark kisses and love.
-MJ

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 17:46

No moshing and jumping when drinking. And here it's the youngsters that can't handle their booze and throw up. Old people just get drunk and fall asleep at worst and only throw up the next day. It's the youngsters that are a nuisance at live gigs. Moshing to music you can't mosh to. Moshing right in front of the bar. Bumping into everyone. There is a place and time to mosh and that is not in the back of the venue and also not right up front in front of the stage.

Ok, I actually agree with this... the stupid fuckers who try and look tough by starting their mosh-rage-charge at the bar, and annihilate every poor bastard in their path to the pit kinda piss me off. And It's almost DANGEROUS to be in the front at shows anymore, because the crowd will push so hard you get smashed into the rails. I personally don't have any padding between my rib cage and the outside world, so it makes it a little on the hazardous side. Which leaves only a few places to hang out at a show, depending on the venue.

In this case i guess it's an advantage to go to gigs in a country where people are as relaxed at gigs as in Romania(some would actually say boring and dull, not even during Slayer was there a really big and brutal moshpit, and even i joined the pit during "Raining Blood"). i've went to at least 15 concerts here in total and the only problem i've ever had was that there were way too many people in the Golden Circle area at the Big 4 day of Sonisphere(namely during Metallica), i was 40 meters from the stage but i still couldn't lift my arms up. on the other hand there weren't as many people going back and forth as during Maiden at Wacken.

Written by Holy Man on 05.03.2011 at 01:56

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.03.2011 at 17:46

No moshing and jumping when drinking. And here it's the youngsters that can't handle their booze and throw up. Old people just get drunk and fall asleep at worst and only throw up the next day. It's the youngsters that are a nuisance at live gigs. Moshing to music you can't mosh to. Moshing right in front of the bar. Bumping into everyone. There is a place and time to mosh and that is not in the back of the venue and also not right up front in front of the stage.

Ok, I actually agree with this... the stupid fuckers who try and look tough by starting their mosh-rage-charge at the bar, and annihilate every poor bastard in their path to the pit kinda piss me off. And It's almost DANGEROUS to be in the front at shows anymore, because the crowd will push so hard you get smashed into the rails. I personally don't have any padding between my rib cage and the outside world, so it makes it a little on the hazardous side. Which leaves only a few places to hang out at a show, depending on the venue.

Man up?

I jest, as I do agree the morons who start shit at the bar need to be taught a lesson, so what do you do? Teach 'em a bloody lesson! I think your interpretation of the danger you're in is hyperbolic, somewhat...

You got to realize that each generation has their bands and scene that introduces them to metal. It's only natural that there's going to be some disparagement. Not everyone can be raised on Metallica and Slayer. If metalcore or whatever gets them in then fine. But us older guys are always gonna say "why don't they do it like us?" We just have to show them that we can still kick ass and metal's not about elitism but community. Seriously. Metal is the heralds cry to the dejected and worthless and that's the reason why we connect with this aggressive style of music. To the rest of the world many of us are just pieces of shit and this music is a catharsis to that anger. Even if these kids are different show them how it's done.

Ok ,I think this is a very important subject.This topic is not simple.The several years media showed the metalheads only appearance ,not the idea .So the new generations thought that "İf I want to be a metalhead I must just wear black and stylish,jewelleries,I must know some best known bands etc." Cos there s an industry making money over this.Of course to b metalhead is not only about your looking,it s about just music,you must know what you listen and why you listen to it,you must feel it,feel the freedom,emotion etc. I also think that a rock concert is not a theathre just to watch the band playing ... Anyway before you come to the concert you must have already listened the albums of the band.You will both watch and live the moment of the live.The appearance is somehow important to show others to tell yourself in a simple way but it is not everything to be e metal listener.The young generations must realise it.