Wow, this was a heartwarming read. Two thumbs up Hellfest!

People are getting overly reactive over a drunk arm gesture of 2 seconds heh?
Welcome to 2016

That's a double-edged sword if I've ever seen one. It's a good read and a sane way to react to somthing like this. But on the other hand, Anselmo's behavior isn't tolerable in a culture that he so verbosely describes. Putting them in this position is a clever political move. They had the choice between acting on political behalf (under pressure, even) or risking to be put in a racist corner. Hopefully they'll wait until this matter has settled and then still drop Down from the lineup.

Quote:
Retailleau said that the city will not promote anything with "incitement to racial or religious hatred."

They have Slayer and Abbath on the lineup yet they call out Anselmo on a drunken outburst? The French government were just looking for any excuse to stop funding.

The world is completely overreacting on this...

Written by corrupt on 11.02.2016 at 15:45

Hopefully they'll wait until this matter has settled and then still drop down from the lineup.

I hope so too.
A couple of years ago they dropped Satanic Warhamster for its driving force being a racist/neo-nazi (although he never was as outspoken about it as Phil in interviews and such), so imo they should also drop Down for its mainman being an outspoken racist/neo-nazi. Which Phil has proven to be for at least a couple of decades now.
But the choice lies absolutely by the porganizers and not the authorities, I'd say.

As a part time politician, I have to say that I agree with the senators ultimatum. In this time and age, not to mention when I read some of the comments above, it's more important than ever to be very restrictive towards racism and hatred. By all means, pull the plug from Hellfest unless they drop Down from the line-up. There's no excuse for what Phil Anselmo did, and he (Down) should of course pay the consequences for that. Hats off to the politicians in this case.

20 000 ? is peanuts for a a fest that manages millions. Plus Anselmo isn't anyone for HF, he is there like every single year and always praises the fest. I still think they should drop Down if they want to remain coherent (like they did with Satanic Warmaster) but I doubt they will as the funding has no real impact.

Written by FreddeSwede on 11.02.2016 at 16:14

(...) and he (Down) (...)

There's a problem there, Anselmo is not Down. it's not fair that his bandmates pay for that as well after all the public apologies by Anselmo (remarking that he didn't wish their bandmates to suffer from all the backlash as well) and the other members from Down expressing their discontent with his gesture.
This move would be understandable against a band whose music and imagery promoted racism or hatred, this is not the case at all.

Written by Unhealer on 11.02.2016 at 16:30

Written by FreddeSwede on 11.02.2016 at 16:14

(...) and he (Down) (...)

There's a problem there, Anselmo is not Down. it's not fair that his bandmates pay for that as well after all the public apologies by Anselmo (remarking that he didn't wish their bandmates to suffer from all the backlash as well) and the other members from Down expressing their discontent with his gesture.
This move would be understandable against a band whose music and imagery promoted racism or hatred, this is not the case at all.

The band members have known about Phil's actions over the past 20 years as well and have always turned a blind eye to it up to now.
As for Phil's apologies... they come across extremely insincere.

Written by Vombatus on 11.02.2016 at 16:30

20 000 ? is peanuts for a a fest that manages millions. Plus Anselmo isn't anyone for HF, he is there like every single year and always praises the fest. I still think they should drop Down if they want to remain coherent (like they did with Satanic Warmaster) but I doubt they will as the funding has no real impact.

20K is what, 125 ticket sales? I doubt they need the subsidiary now in any way.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 11.02.2016 at 16:41


The band members have known about Phil's actions over the past 20 years as well and have always turned a blind eye to it up to now.
As for Phil's apologies... they come across extremely insincere.

What other actions from Anselmo? Did he do something like this before? I'm seriously asking because I looked it up and didn't find other testimonies, only people repeating "Yeah, Anselmo is racist, everybody knows that" all over.
If the dude has always been like this I wonder how only after 20 years the guy is getting a backlash. Also, if everybody knew about this then not only Down but festival organizers, labels, distributors, fellow musicians etc. were turning a blind eye on him so far, and are only jumping against him now that the matter is all over the social media and can benefit from going against him, Robb Flynn being a perfect example.

Written by Unhealer on 11.02.2016 at 17:00

What other actions from Anselmo? Did he do something like this before? I'm seriously asking because I looked it up and didn't find other testimonies, only people repeating "Yeah, Anselmo is racist, everybody knows that" all over.
If the dude has always been like this I wonder how only after 20 years the guy is getting a backlash. Also, if everybody knew about this then not only Down but festival organizers, labels, distributors, fellow musicians etc. were turning a blind eye on him so far, and are only jumping against him now that the matter is all over the social media and can benefit from going against him, Robb Flynn being a perfect example.

Just like people pulling the racist Pantera lyrics thing. Ask them to produce examples and people either can't or pull out the most vague songs that could be about anything. Standard Twitter syndrome: everything gets amplified and exaggerated by keyboard warriors. People say "Oh, they've turned a blind eye to it for 20 years." Well, apparently so has everyone else then if it's that common knowledge. Hypocrites. He may be racist, but internet muppets retroactively ascribing racism to everything he's done annoys me.

Written by [user id=4365] on 11.02.2016 at 16:47

20K is what, 125 ticket sales? I doubt they need the subsidiary now in any way.

Yeah, exactly my point. HF has always done very well with close to none government help, and will probably continue to do so.

More interesting to see will be how anti-racist punk and hardcore bands like Ludwig Von 88, August Burns Red or Heaven Shall Burn Will react.
The politicians mentioned here are just in the controversy to please their more obtuse, catholic voters. Remember Vendée is really a conservative Catholic bastion in France.

This decision comes from the region (Pays de la Loire), which is led by LR (Les Républicains), opposed to the government... So the title is not true !

Les festivales des Marin le Pen sorry Wrat, Sebastian . typing whit oit spell check francaise ... but seems so

@Joe, Unhealer

If you watched Robb Flynn's video, he even admits that he's witnessed and overheard such sentiments from Phil's mouth numerous times through the years, but always ignored it or brushed it off because "it was Phil, and Phil's a big dude, and Phil's a legend, etc. etc. etc.", but has finally decided to speak up about it.

Just saying.

I wish Jeff was in this site now , since he works there and is there any video new savlible, I hate read so much on PC

Written by psykometal on 11.02.2016 at 20:34

@Joe, Unhealer

If you watched Robb Flynn's video, he even admits that he's witnessed and overheard such sentiments from Phil's mouth numerous times through the years, but always ignored it or brushed it off because "it was Phil, and Phil's a big dude, and Phil's a legend, etc. etc. etc.", but has finally decided to speak up about it.

Just saying.

He also insisted that Phil was drinking German beer, and that there was no white wine backstage, which turned out to be a total lie. So, yeah.

He decided to speak up about it now because the whole internet kicked up a fuss. What a big brave man. If he had a backbone, or any real principles he would have cut ties with him years ago. If I knew a racist I wouldn't give him / her the time of day.

Written by [user id=4365] on 11.02.2016 at 20:42

He also insisted that Phil was drinking German beer, and that there was no white wine backstage, which turned out to be a total lie. So, yeah.

When was that outed as being a lie? I haven't seen that... O_o

Quote:

He decided to speak up about it now because the whole internet kicked up a fuss. What a big brave man. If he had a backbone, or any real principles he would have cut ties with him years ago. If I knew a racist I wouldn't give him / her the time of day.

And I agree, it's kinda fucked that he came out after the fan posted it instead of saying something years ago, or just "unfriending" him in life, but oh well.

The digital age is in fuller effect in 2016.

Written by psykometal on 11.02.2016 at 21:36

When was that outed as being a lie? I haven't seen that... O_o


And I agree, it's kinda fucked that he came out after the fan posted it instead of saying something years ago, or just "unfriending" him in life, but oh well.

The digital age is in fuller effect in 2016.

From here:

http://www.blabbermouth.net/news/ex-machine-head-drummer-says-robb-flynn-and-philip-anselmo-are-both-dumbass-self-centered-blowhards/

How balanced it is is anyone's guess, but the fact he condemns both parties makes me think it's probably one of the more reliable sources.

If Phil is as racist as he is, I'm amazed this all hasn't come out earlier in a bigger way. Reminds me of the BBC and others who turned a blind eye to Jimmy Savile's pedo activities for decades. People only care when they have no choice but to, otherwise they can cover it up with a blanket and forget about it. When it does finally all come out everyone jumps in on it and it's impossible to know what's real and what isn't because everyone wants to have a go.

So what! He can believe whatever he wants. What bunch of hypocrites! If some gangsta rapper started some anti-white shit not a goddamn thing would be said. Same goes for queers,muslims or whoever it may be. You don't have to like or go see them play. To make this big of a deal is the same ole song and dance by all those shoving tolerance down our throats but are being intolerate themselves.

Good post Joe.

This has been blown out of proportion. 20k Euro is nothing for such a big festival.

Hopefully Phil has learned a lesson.

As for Flynn, the guy's always been an attention seeking trendwhore since he started out. Anyone remember his feud with Kerry King from Slayer? It's supported by his band constantly jumping from one trend to another. I think there aren't many people in metal who have craved attention as much as Robb Flynn (or to be fair Phil Anselmo nut at least he is true to his music! ).

Written by Bad English on 11.02.2016 at 20:35

I wish Jeff was in this site now , since he works there and is there any video new savlible, I hate read so much on PC

Jeff hasn't worked for Hellfest for a long long time.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 12.02.2016 at 01:15

Written by Bad English on 11.02.2016 at 20:35

I wish Jeff was in this site now , since he works there and is there any video new savlible, I hate read so much on PC

Jeff hasn't worked for Hellfest for a long long time.

really? I thought he still works there as promoter

Written by Timelord on 12.02.2016 at 00:01

If some gangsta rapper started some anti-white shit not a goddamn thing would be said

Oh yeah, that classic "if black people do X, no one bats an eye, but if white people do X, everyone loses their minds" argument. Hey, you know why that might be, people not starting as big an uproar over people of color putting out messages that could be construed as anti white as they do over the reverse happening? I dunno, maybe it could have something to do with the fact that, over the past 500 years, there haven't been many examples of societies in which POC have oppressed and persecuted white people, but on the other hand there have been numerous cases of societies in which the whites have been the ones laying the oppression and persecution upon POC. There is simply not a history of societies dominated by POC making life extremely difficult for white people in the manner in which the periods of American slavery and European imperialism saw societies dominated by whites making life extremely difficult for POC.

Maybe that in turn might create an atmosphere today in which comments suggestive of anti-POC, white supremacist beliefs raise more of an eyebrow among people than those suggesting anti-white beliefs. Just a thought.

State saying what can and can not play... sounds like Kuwait just banned Swallow the cum , sounds like church speaks.
Its up to organizers , not state decide what to do Madmazel Marin le Pen has said more stupid things as Anselmo and keeps saying it and non cares...its up to organizers , but before dropping band, then band all PSG and OL fans from going to footy, since most of their ultras are WP and has done actions what Ansy has not.
Its up from promoters only, not state, next will be we cant attend concert at sunday, we need be in a church

I doubt band will drop out , promoters needs fans and event going unless fans wont vote out, only what FRance can do reject Schengen visa and make sure they wont get in other country, its all what state can do,

Written by Auntie Sahar on 12.02.2016 at 01:38

Written by Timelord on 12.02.2016 at 00:01

If some gangsta rapper started some anti-white shit not a goddamn thing would be said

Oh yeah, that classic "if black people do X, no one bats an eye, but if white people do X, everyone loses their minds" argument. Hey, you know why that might be, people not starting as big an uproar over people of color putting out messages that could be construed as anti white as they do over the reverse happening? I dunno, maybe it could have something to do with the fact that, over the past 500 years, there haven't been many examples of societies in which POC have oppressed and persecuted white people, but on the other hand there have been numerous cases of societies in which the whites have been the ones laying the oppression and persecution upon POC. There is simply not a history of societies dominated by POC making life extremely difficult for white people in the manner in which the periods of American slavery and European imperialism saw societies dominated by whites making life extremely difficult for POC.

Maybe that in turn might create an atmosphere today in which comments suggestive of anti-POC, white supremacist beliefs raise more of an eyebrow among people than those suggesting anti-white beliefs. Just a thought.

So 500 years of European political domination means it's ok for "people of colour" to be racist?

It's a poor argument especially as Europeans had a tendency to persecute each other (e.g. the Irish, Jews, Catalans, Protestants, Catholics) and as "People Of Colour" also gladly persecute each other.

Did you know for example that some of main beneficiaries of the African slave trade were African kingdoms ala Benin or Dahomey who could dictate prices for their human cargo? The Ghana and Mali Empires were built on slave trade with Arabs. We remember European slavery cause we're mainly European or live in European societies.

Slavery has been a fact of African life since time immemorial. And it's still common place, especially in countries like Mauritania, Niger and Sudan, despite white people trying to outlaw the practice since 19th century!

Quote:

There is simply not a history of societies dominated by POC making life extremely difficult for white people in the manner in which the periods of American slavery and European imperialism saw societies dominated by whites making life extremely difficult for POC.

Have you ever heard of the Ottoman Empire? Try being a white Christian there. Indeed the term genocide was first used to describe the Ottoman annihilation of Christian Armenians in 1915-18.


Imperialism didn't really change much for your average POC. They lived in abject poverty and under some sort of tyrannical government before whites conquered them and were oppressed and exploited regardless. This stayed the same while whites ruled and continued after the whites left. It doesn't matter if the tyrant was a local king or warlord, a distant emperor, a European power or a general or "democratically elected" leader. It's all the same.

Do you seriously think that the non-European world was some sort of utopia before whites came? It was just as fucked as it always was. War, poverty, hunger and oppression are a way of the world.

The only difference now is some Western European nations and a few ex-British colonies as well as 3-4 Asian states have got a bit more humane in their treatment of people. Rest of the world continues as it's always done.


So black guy singing about hating whites is the same as white guy hating blacks. Nothing justifies hypocrisy.

Written by Spirit of dead on 12.02.2016 at 02:14

So 500 years of European political domination means it's ok for "people of colour" to be racist?

Yup, nice way of (grossly) oversimplifying and misinterpreting what I was trying to say. That straw man just flushed any prior consideration I may have had about engaging you in debate right down the drain

Written by Auntie Sahar on 12.02.2016 at 02:31


Yup, nice way of (grossly) oversimplifying and misinterpreting what I was trying to say. That straw man just flushed any prior consideration I may have had about engaging you in debate right down the drain

Actually the oversimplification is exactly what you said. Basically your argument is intolerance is worse when it's by whites because of slavery and imperialism. Ergo non-white intolerance against whites is more acceptable than white intolerance.

And if being persecuted at some point makes your intolerance more acceptable, then all intolerance is acceptable because at some stage all people's were persecuted including lots of white peoples.


According to the values of our modern Western society, intolerance of any sort should be deplored regardless of prior historical context. So rappers singing about "Killing Whitey" is as bad as NSBM/hatecore bands singing about killing blacks.