Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.07.2008 at 15:35

Written by [user id=30512] on 10.07.2008 at 15:29


If metal wouldn't be influenced by new wave all these "cool metalguys" wouldn't be walking around with electric guitars and that kind of stuff. Without bands such as new wave I think there wouldn't even be metal.

What kind of bollocks is this?
No electric guitars without new wave? My fucking God what the hell are you tripping on?
Hendrix, Clapton, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, MC5 etc all played electric guitar before there was even such a thing as new wave.

lol, don't forget Bill Haley or Chuck Berry, they played electric guitars in the early 50s lol back when the radio was the coolest thing in the world..

Written by Valentin B on 10.07.2008 at 15:48

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.07.2008 at 15:35

Written by [user id=30512] on 10.07.2008 at 15:29


If metal wouldn't be influenced by new wave all these "cool metalguys" wouldn't be walking around with electric guitars and that kind of stuff. Without bands such as new wave I think there wouldn't even be metal.

What kind of bollocks is this?
No electric guitars without new wave? My fucking God what the hell are you tripping on?
Hendrix, Clapton, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, MC5 etc all played electric guitar before there was even such a thing as new wave.

lol, don't forget Bill Haley or Chuck Berry, they played electric guitars in the early 50s lol back when the radio was the coolest thing in the world..

Yes, my bad for not mentioning them since they have had a lot of influence on rock, hard rock, metal

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.07.2008 at 15:52

Written by Valentin B on 10.07.2008 at 15:48

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.07.2008 at 15:35

Written by [user id=30512] on 10.07.2008 at 15:29


If metal wouldn't be influenced by new wave all these "cool metalguys" wouldn't be walking around with electric guitars and that kind of stuff. Without bands such as new wave I think there wouldn't even be metal.

What kind of bollocks is this?
No electric guitars without new wave? My fucking God what the hell are you tripping on?
Hendrix, Clapton, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, MC5 etc all played electric guitar before there was even such a thing as new wave.

lol, don't forget Bill Haley or Chuck Berry, they played electric guitars in the early 50s lol back when the radio was the coolest thing in the world..

Yes, my bad for not mentioning them since they have had a lot of influence on rock, hard rock, metal

i didn't say that, sure they were rock n roll pioneers. i meant that those guys were active ages before any new wave(whatever that might be in Aei Ontos's mind).

their influence on metal as a whole is debatable though, since Sabbath basically invented heavy metal with only a little rock 'n roll influence(the song Paranoid comes to mind), you might say Priest added the rock 'n roll touch with their first album, but on Sad Wings at least, it's clear they got some inspiration from Sabbath, with the slow riffs(Genocide, Victim of Changes- VoC wouldn't sound at all out of place on Paranoid come to think of it) and blues inspired solo's(again Victim of Changes, and Dreamer Deceiver)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_guitar#Early_years
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Wave_music

Written by [user id=23267] on 07.07.2008 at 15:10

Oh, and no offense, but presenting revisionist viewpoints as hard fact, without citing any evidence, makes you look like a moron.

If you were literate, you'd know that an argument is stated and entered before proof is offered.

These facts are revisionist -- they're just unknown to the rock fans, who generally don't bother to read much on the subject.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.07.2008 at 15:35

Written by [user id=30512] on 10.07.2008 at 15:29


If metal wouldn't be influenced by new wave all these "cool metalguys" wouldn't be walking around with electric guitars and that kind of stuff. Without bands such as new wave I think there wouldn't even be metal.

What kind of bollocks is this?
No electric guitars without new wave? My fucking God what the hell are you tripping on?
Hendrix, Clapton, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, MC5 etc all played electric guitar before there was even such a thing as new wave.

Im pretty sure hes joking....or I hope he is.

Written by Doc G. on 11.07.2008 at 02:49

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.07.2008 at 15:35

Written by [user id=30512] on 10.07.2008 at 15:29


If metal wouldn't be influenced by new wave all these "cool metalguys" wouldn't be walking around with electric guitars and that kind of stuff. Without bands such as new wave I think there wouldn't even be metal.

What kind of bollocks is this?
No electric guitars without new wave? My fucking God what the hell are you tripping on?
Hendrix, Clapton, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, MC5 etc all played electric guitar before there was even such a thing as new wave.

Im pretty sure hes joking....or I hope he is.

I never can tell anymore on MS if someone is kidding or not...and yeah, not even anything hair metal in the late 80s came from the new wave scene of the early-mid 80s...

I always agree with the whole idea of heavy metal's deep distorted chordal tone in electric guitars being borne from those double bass violins from the Victorian era of European Classical music that required two people to play...one for the lower end and one for the upper end...and how virtuosic composers like Bach, Beethoven and Mozart would fit in well into the heavy metal 'million-notes-a-bar' virtuoso compositions...

Written by Conservationist on 10.07.2008 at 20:32

If you were literate, you'd know that an argument is stated and entered before proof is offered.

According to your logic, if you were literate, you would have offered the proof after stating the argument.

Somebody re-open this discussion, it's good. I want post my opinion again, my english is no good but I'll try to be clear.
"Cream", "Yardbirds" and Jimmi Hendrix were pioneers of metal and they were rock bands and rock musicians. The first time that the "heavy metal" term is used in music is in "Born to be Wild" of Steppenwolf ("heavy metal" term was invented by the north american writer William Burroughs in his novel "Nova Express" in 1967), and in those years the music was rock and hard rock. I think metal IS rock, metal is not a "sub-genre" of rock, is THE evolution of rock, is the most direct line through rock evolved.
I began, when I was 7 years old, listening rock'n roll and since then I followed the evolution of rock, loving that music, and trying to go through the most direct line, now I'm listening and loving heavy metal, thrash metal and death metal.
That's my opinion

I think Metal really come from rock, Its proven, take an early Judas Priest album and an AC/DC, they are of course different but also have something in common. However, metal is not part of rock anymore IMO

Written by [user id=23267] on 11.07.2008 at 14:24

Written by Conservationist on 10.07.2008 at 20:32

If you were literate, you'd know that an argument is stated and entered before proof is offered.

According to your logic, if you were literate, you would have offered the proof after stating the argument.

...were this a debate, but as we can see from your behavior it is not, nor are you literate in debate or logical argument, so why would I debate it? YOUR assertion was that correct procedure was not followed, and you have failed to defend it, which makes you unqualified to continue a debate on this topic

Written by -Valhalla- on 08.04.2007 at 07:40

I'd have to say Metal spawned from hardcore punk

Yeah I know, old post. You do know that the early forms of metal came before Hardcore right? Hardcore Punk didn't really come until the late 70's....lets count the number of metal/quasi metal bands that came out before/around that time:
Black Sabbath
Motorhead
Deep Purple
Led Zeppelin
Blue Oyster Cult
Judas Priest
Rainbow

And some bands that had a direct influence on metal (some of which often considered heavy metal at the time):
Kiss
Alice Cooper
Thin Lizzy
Uriah Heep
Whitesnake
Scorpions
Rush
AC/DC

While I agree punk and metal have their evolutions pretty closely tied, and that Hardcore punk influenced a lot of metal...metal was not spawned from hardcore punk.

Written by -Valhalla- on 08.04.2007 at 07:40

I'd have to say Metal spawned from hardcore punk

Well...more extreme sub genres of metal spawned from hardcore punk, no?

Written by [user id=2084] on 29.10.2008 at 03:36

Written by Doc G. on 29.10.2008 at 01:18

I'd have to say Metal spawned from hardcore punk

Well...more extreme sub genres of metal spawned from hardcore punk, no?

Something went wrong with your quoting, it shows it so I said that false statement...which I didn't.

Anyways, yeah I'll openly agree (like I did before) that I think hardcore punk did have a huge impact on metal, but to say metal as a genre spawned from hardcore punk is really false, considering there is many metal bands these days that don't have any hardcore influences.

Metal is it's own genre now but: no rock=no metal.

Written by Number Juan on 29.10.2008 at 04:28

Metal is it's own genre now but: no rock=no metal.

yep and no blues=no rock

Metal aint no rock, rock aint no metal, but blues its roots for all of those genres , if people do not see it then I want ask my self, why I live in this earth , can not understand it ,

Ok so we are talking about influence of rock, blues, punk, etc. in Metal. But don't forget of classical music. without Richard Wagner or Beethoven there wouldn´t be Metal. Metal has been influenced by many genres, and it's influence from Rock IMO can't be cuestionable.

Metal came from mainly Blues with some rock, punk and classical influences. Black Sabbath themselves were originally a Blues Band.

Metal also came from classical music...this is proven with those large double basses where two people have to play it...one for the bottom and one for the top...the really heavy staccato driving sound you can get from that translated later on in metal into the distorted riffing guitar sound...also I would have to say jazz fusion because of all the crazy solo techniques and patterns that metal guitarists use...

Blues came from folk, folk came from early music and classical, early music came from religious ceremonial music, and all of that came from Greco-Roman music. Rock and blues are just marketing names for things that have been around for a long, long time, especially the pentatonic scales which are in use in Asia, the Middle East and Europe.

Written by [user id=35853] on 18.11.2008 at 11:19

Written by Number Juan on 29.10.2008 at 04:28

Metal is it's own genre now but: no rock=no metal.

yep and no blues=no rock

yep and no gospel = no blues

Written by Dane Train on 17.04.2009 at 23:22

Written by [user id=35853] on 18.11.2008 at 11:19

Written by Number Juan on 29.10.2008 at 04:28

Metal is it's own genre now but: no rock=no metal.

yep and no blues=no rock

yep and no gospel = no blues

yep and no black people = no gospel

Written by Elio on 17.04.2009 at 23:37

yep and no black people = no gospel

Gospel harmonies and many of the hymns themselves also show a clear Scottish influence. Recent studies by Professor Willie Ruff, an Afro-American ethno-musicologist at Yale University, conclude that African American Gospel singing was in fact was encouraged by Scottish Gaelic speaking settlers from North Uist[1] Thus, traditional Scottish Gaelic psalm singing, in which the psalms are called out and the congregation sings a response, may have been the earliest form of congregational singing adopted by Africans in America.

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Gospel_music

There's a world of knowledge outside what your TV says.

Saying no black music equals no gospel is bullshit...just look up the Gregorian Chants of Europe from the 13th and 14th Century...primitive gospel roots in Caucasian backgrounds...

And no rock equals no metal is probably bullshit too lol...think about it down to its basic elements...

A) a simple riffing churn: Classical roots derived from double bass violens

THEN

B: a crazy solo that goes all over the place: Jazz fusion

No jazz fusion and no classical music = no metal

Written by [user id=2084] on 18.04.2009 at 07:22

Saying no black music equals no gospel is bullshit...just look up the Gregorian Chants of Europe from the 13th and 14th Century...primitive gospel roots in Caucasian backgrounds...

And no rock equals no metal is probably bullshit too lol...think about it down to its basic elements...

A) a simple riffing churn: Classical roots derived from double bass violens

THEN

B: a crazy solo that goes all over the place: Jazz fusion

No jazz fusion and no classical music = no metal

Well, in reference to todays bands I'd agree with you, but unfortunately the question is "Did metal come from rock?". While I'll agree that metal has progressed into its own genre, its roots do lie in rock, regardless of what influences have been pulled in since then.

Written by Conemetal on 12.07.2008 at 23:36

Somebody re-open this discussion, it's good. I want post my opinion again, my english is no good but I'll try to be clear.
"Cream", "Yardbirds" and Jimmi Hendrix were pioneers of metal and they were rock bands and rock musicians. The first time that the "heavy metal" term is used in music is in "Born to be Wild" of Steppenwolf ("heavy metal" term was invented by the north american writer William Burroughs in his novel "Nova Express" in 1967), and in those years the music was rock and hard rock. I think metal IS rock, metal is not a "sub-genre" of rock, is THE evolution of rock, is the most direct line through rock evolved.
I began, when I was 7 years old, listening rock'n roll and since then I followed the evolution of rock, loving that music, and trying to go through the most direct line, now I'm listening and loving heavy metal, thrash metal and death metal.
That's my opinion

I agree with you, metal is more like an evolution, not a sub-genre.

@Dr. Rock: Yeah, you're right...just like what Conemetal there said...bands like Judas Priest, Iron Maiden and Motorhead turned what acts like Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath and Alice Copper into something harder and ballsier...

I was always under the impression that one morning, after an all night drinking binge, Dio went to the bathroom to do his business and when done looked down at the toilet and there was Heavy Metal music.

@Dane: hahahaha...

"And Dio said: Let There Be Metal!"

It should be Halford, for he is The Metal God.