My big problem with Obama right now is his notion of "change". Sure, it makes for a great drinking game; take a shot whenever Obama says "change" or McCain says 'maverick", but I have not see any real plans from Obama or McCain either.

It seems the politicians in America are not willing to be humble. I would be more interested in listening to a politician who flat out says "I don't have all the answers, but I will surround myself with the smartest people in needed fields and work on plans to begin fixing things around here." I want politicians who are human, not superhuman.

Did anyone see the debate? I streamed it on MSn at work this morning......Mccain is an ass . Did y'all see his rampant egotism and failure to appear 'presidential' ?

I mean FOR THE BAHAMAS, we'd be better off with Mccain (considering Obama says he'll make Foreigners (Americans) pay taxes for having land overseas), but hopefully he won't fulfill that promise. But above all, I like Obama better.

Taka Im afraid you and I do not understand each other. That is really ok. We do have different experiences as do most of you and I. It really is ok

You see one major difference between you and I is that you look at the bottom 50% as victims of society, I look at the bottom 50% as victims of themselves. We all have different roads to travel but even in Austria people have the ability to advance.

Taka said "Maybe you have the wrong government."

Please do not send me your type of govt. You are happy?? yay. Mine is the only one of its kind being corrupted by Marxist values. You see profit as evil where as I see profit as a motivator. Remember I wish clarity to agreement. I do not wish to change your mind. You are set in your ways. It is more helpful that we understand each other than agree.

As for your last point on taxes, that is a fundamental disagreement between your life and mine. I don't look at the net and say good job. I look at the gross and say where did it go ? It was the Great Marxist FDr who first introduced the weekly tax reduction whereas before you had to pay the bill annually. Add you annual tax bill and pretend you had to write a check. See if that number burns your ass.

In the end I guess we will agree to disagree. You approve of a progressive tax, and I do not.

Good day and excelsior

Written by akatana on 17.10.2008 at 10:08

Written by Dane Train on 17.10.2008 at 02:06

My big problem with Obama right now is his notion of "change". Sure, it makes for a great drinking game; take a shot whenever Obama says "change" or McCain says 'maverick", but I have not see any real plans from Obama or McCain either.

It seems the politicians in America are not willing to be humble. I would be more interested in listening to a politician who flat out says "I don't have all the answers, but I will surround myself with the smartest people in needed fields and work on plans to begin fixing things around here." I want politicians who are human, not superhuman.

If any politician would say that he would be done. Of course you and I and a couple of others would vote for him but the great majority see this as a sign of weakness. Political discourse has become too populist. If a politician is a realist this days he has no chance.

If lobbyists are fronting you the cash needed to run a campaign, they want you to be firm in your beliefs to ensure that their money will not go to waste when you lose. Look at the "other" parties, most of those people are realists but everyone just sees them as a waste of time and votes. A candidate must achieve this superhuman celebrity status in order for anyone to take them seriously, and this includes the media who desperately want controversial candidates to provide them with as many top-selling stories as possible. At this point in the election I think many Americans have become jaded with the whole process and that it comes down to a choice of the lesser of two evils...

Taka, If you would like to know me....really....or people who think like me, just read Ayn Rand

She was a Russian immigrant in the 1920s who came the the U.S. She had seen the worst (like yourself) and in her eyes seen the best. She wrote several of the greatest philisophical novels of all time along with many philosophy articles. Her philosophy is Objectivism which follows the Aristitilian model and not the Platonic model. From Locke to Hobbs, to Jefferson.

I truely believe in the greatness of man, the idividualist in man.

Finally I believe in the trinity found on our currency.

1. e pluribus unam .............. From many one
2. Libery and ( notice it does dot say equality.)
3. In God we trust

For me Government has one man legitimate function.
Protect me from external threats ..... the military
internal threats ..... the police
intellectual threats ..... the courts

Good day

One big thing that I dislike about U.S. elections in general is that they only ever have two known candidates (one republican, one democrat). They exclude third party candidates (RALPH NADER) on purpose so that American citizens will never have a good choice to vote for. Democrats and Republicans are growing ever more corrupt because they can do whatever the hell they want because they'll still be the only choices anyways.
In my mind they're both evil, just democrats are a slightly lesser evil.

Written by [user id=34045] on 20.10.2008 at 01:50

One big thing that I dislike about U.S. elections in general is that they only ever have two known candidates (one republican, one democrat). They exclude third party candidates (RALPH NADER) on purpose so that American citizens will never have a good choice to vote for. Democrats and Republicans are growing ever more corrupt because they can do whatever the hell they want because they'll still be the only choices anyways.
In my mind they're both evil, just democrats are a slightly lesser evil.

Exactly! Our election system in the US is horribly outdated and needs to be completely revamped. The "winner takes all" mentality behind our elections encourages parties to be fewer, larger, more corrupt, and as generic as possible to appeal to as many people as possible. Thus, the system forces us to pick between 2 choices, neither of which is what we are looking for. No matter how close the election is, the loser gets nothing, leaving all of the people that voted for them unrepresented! To make things even worse, you can win the presidency while losing the popular vote b/c of how the electoral college works! Who cares "what the founding fathers intended!" They made the best system they could for their time, and should be commended for it, but that system isn't what we need NOW.

Written by Hrothdane on 20.10.2008 at 02:36

Written by [user id=34045] on 20.10.2008 at 01:50

One big thing that I dislike about U.S. elections in general is that they only ever have two known candidates (one republican, one democrat). They exclude third party candidates (RALPH NADER) on purpose so that American citizens will never have a good choice to vote for. Democrats and Republicans are growing ever more corrupt because they can do whatever the hell they want because they'll still be the only choices anyways.
In my mind they're both evil, just democrats are a slightly lesser evil.

Exactly! Our election system in the US is horribly outdated and needs to be completely revamped. The "winner takes all" mentality behind our elections encourages parties to be fewer, larger, more corrupt, and as generic as possible to appeal to as many people as possible. Thus, the system forces us to pick between 2 choices, neither of which is what we are looking for. No matter how close the election is, the loser gets nothing, leaving all of the people that voted for them unrepresented! To make things even worse, you can win the presidency while losing the popular vote b/c of how the electoral college works! Who cares "what the founding fathers intended!" They made the best system they could for their time, and should be commended for it, but that system isn't what we need NOW.

I agree man...I doubt the American system will change anytime soon though , but it's not really that mentality that enourages two parties imo. It's that independant candidates don't really have the best interests of corporations and such in mind. The rich elites want either Republicans or Democrats to win so that they will carry out their best interests so they send lobbyest on their behalf to help them. The Democrats and Republicans then use devices such as the media, the National Conventions, the Presidential Debates (where independant candidates are not allowed), ect to make sure that people will always choose between the two big parties so they will always maintain power.

These, as well as many other factors pretty much create a perfect storm which will dominate American politics for quite sometime I think.

Has anyone seen Aaron Russo's video from freedom to fascism? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1656880303867390173

He died last year, but he was featured briefly in the Zeitgeist video as being a one time friend of Nicholas Rockefeller. There is also a book out by ron paul called The Revolution : A Manifesto. http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0446537519/ref=sib_dp_ptu#reader-link There is a link to an excerpt to the book...

This election is a joke...

On the issue of U.S. politics I feel I can give you an objective perspective. The 2 party system is a function of the 2 major parties. these 2 parties write the election laws, petition laws for registration, etc. they write the rules that stagnate the 3rd parties. Make no mistake I would prefer someone other than McCain/Obama. Neither is adequate.

Taka, you really seem to favor the got being in control of major issues like health and social care. Is that your main concern for a proper govt?

In your country does personal responsibility come into play at all?

do the intelligent rise to the top or are most of the funds left to picking up the bottom half?

these are real questions not rhetorical ones. You have a different life expeirence than I and others so what motivates the Austrian vote?

McCain comment about Obama being evil for advocating redistribution of wealth = DESPERATE FAIL

Written by akatana on 20.10.2008 at 19:14

Written by Konrad on 20.10.2008 at 16:08

Has anyone seen Aaron Russo's video from freedom to fascism? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1656880303867390173

He died last year, but he was featured briefly in the Zeitgeist video as being a one time friend of Nicholas Rockefeller. There is also a book out by ron paul called The Revolution : A Manifesto. http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0446537519/ref=sib_dp_ptu#reader-link There is a link to an excerpt to the book...

This election is a joke...

another thing on ron paul. As I told you, I don;t agree with him on the economy, health care and social security and a couple of other things but I do think he is great. I saw a video Candidates@Google and he said that he thinks switzerland has a good political system and I agree with him. After living there for over a year I have to say that switzerland probably has the best political and government system in the world, including health care and social care. We can discuss ron paul more if you want because even if I don;t agree with him on many things he surely is a nice change in the conservative establishment of the usa.

Ron Paul wrote a very interesting documentary on the Federal Reserve System. http://mises.org/books/freedomsiege.pdf

I think that the media always finds things to point him out as being eccentric picks on him with stupid issues that they just want people to argue over like Abortion...but I think that it really says something that he ran 9 terms in Texas, and also that the American people on a local level seem to have the capacity to elect good leaders...or atleast re-elect them. It's to bad the country is totally brainwashed by propaghanda. Anyways I hope you find this article interesting...the Country needs to stick to the constitution...it is not old or outdated...it is hanging by a thread and we need to go back to it's principles. Here is a very interesting quote:

''A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse form the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage. ''
-Alexander Tyler

As a young American having the chance to participate in his first Presidential Election I am safe in saying from what amount of information I have researched and collected that I am thoroughly dissatisfied with what is presented before me and my fellow American counterparts. Now obviously there is going to be disagreement among us as human being on certain issues, so how can people not see such a flaw in America's two party system? Regardless of how you argue it, any vote cast for a candidate of a party other than Democrat or Republican is a "worthless" vote. I again reiterate what I believe in, from what I have experienced, researched, and heard of:

Less Free Trade (Need jobs here in America)
Finish up in Iraq
Grant illegal Immigrants citizenship (Walls and deportation is too Soviet Union for my taste)
Progressive Taxation
Less drug regulation (Especially mary jane.)
Alternative Power
Environmental Regulations (Pro Environmental that is.)
Private Social Security (People need some say so over the money they make.)
No Death Penalty
Gay Rights and Marriage
Abortion Legal (If they're going to do it, let them do it. No partial birth abortion.)
Welfare Programs that don't just support, but push people to support themselves. (Get them off on the right foot.)
More federal funding for college. (Everyone needs to get a chance to go.)
Objective Religious Studies (Sorry Ron, but no creationism, please. Not as a fundamental study at least.)
Right to Gun Ownership

Those are nearly the same as I felt last time, though I ended up finding the flaw inherit in a flat tax and "equality" among taxation. While all of those opinions are ideal (and are always subject to change) the biggest one seems to be health care, which is still the most complicated topic for me to agree with. However, my choice of a presidential candidate would have to have a majority of these, though I understand a complete agreement on said issues would be highly unlikely and wishful thinking.

So it gets me back to my problem: neither of the two candidates who have the only chance of winning (McCain and Obama, which are both on the Republican and Democratic platforms, respectively) satisfy nearly enough of my "desires" to push me to elect them. They both seem like poor excuses for a president but judging from what he currently have and what we've had, it's obvious Americans don't really care about quality. I really don't know anymore. Election is the 4th of November so I guess I'll have to make my mind up to either vote for the lesser of "two evils" (which really I should be selecting the greater of two goods), casting my vote as a "worthless"; "wasted"; or "meaningless" vote for a third party candidate, or just not voting at all because I refuse to vote. Quite a mess it is.

First let me make the point that all my brothers in other countries do not see our election from an objective voice. Whether it's a study form the CMI or Harvard, or UCLA..., ALL, ALL, ALL, did I say ALL yet, ALL surveys, and studies find that the media is biased to the left. so if you watch NBC, ABC, CBS, CNBC, MSNBC, CNN CBC, etc.. not only that but over 80% of the media voted left.
So with this knowledge that is irrefutable it is no wonder that if someone tells you something long enough, it becomes true even if it is not.
Taka these points are addressed to your last post. Character assignation only occurs if the facts are wrong. Barak has had an anti American preacher, partied with a domestic terrorist, also friends with and partied with a PLO member Rashid Khalidi, as reported by the LA times, Friends with a convicted felon Rezko who sold him his million dollar home and is now is jail for fraud, with these friends VBarak could not even get a mid level security clearance in the federal government. He recently compared the U.S. to Nazi Germany in 2001 and said our constitution is a flawed document.
We are more than willing to elect a Black President, just one whom has values that reflect that which we believe. As for the separation argument I'll leave it to you to resource where it is founded, it does not exist in any official document.
As for gun control, you my pry my gun out of my cold dead fingers, you being a European and a Jew should know best that guns are you friend not your enemy!
As far as taxes the last three times that taxes have been lowered they have resulted in greater government revenues. IE Kennedy, Reagan, and GW Bush. You can look that up at the website of the CBO. Revenues grow when taxes are lower, as proven by the Laffer curve. There comes a point in any taxation where revenues decrease when rates are too high.
I do NOT want a common candidate. The candidate represents 300 million people and should be exceptionally moral, wise and strong.
The difference between France and the U.S. is this. The French revolution gave them liberty equality and fraternity, the U.S. revolution gave us Life Liberty and the pursuit of happiness. On all our coins we have the trilogy...
1 in god we trust
2 liberty
3 e pluribus Unum
We put much stock in liberty and not equality!!! that is the major point
You have all the social democracy you want in Western Europe, why must you want that here. This is for better or worse a different form of government, it is or was the only one of its kind on a large scale.
Barak is a western style European politician with his spread the wealth rhetoric and leftist anti productive policies!!

well enough said so good day and EXCELSIOR

God, can this just be over already...
If I see one more campaign ad I'm going to put flag pins through my eyes...

Personally, i don't trust either of the two candidates. i think that McCain will be more of the same and Palin is impotent as a leader, on the other hand i don't trust Obama either. he talks too well in my opinion and that's dangerous because those people can mislead their people easily. but if i had to vote, then mine would go to obama, because he wants egalitarian freedom and not that pursuit of hapiness ideology(that's just another word for survival of the fittest and a state should want to let everybody survive, nut just the fittest)

Nice post taka

It doesn't matter who wins, the central bank controls america not the president.

Check this:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fTahZE4q90U

Written by akatana on 30.10.2008 at 23:02

...

Thanks for you input, but I was wondering what you thought about Social Security and private vs federal?

Written by Clintagräm on 30.10.2008 at 21:42
or just not voting at all because I refuse to vote. Quite a mess it is.

As much as I am a fan of wanting something to come by doing nothing, I have to stress I don't believe that will be very successful in this scenario

Written by akatana on 02.11.2008 at 14:32

Written by Clintagräm on 02.11.2008 at 06:40

Written by akatana on 30.10.2008 at 23:02

...

Thanks for you input, but I was wondering what you thought about Social Security and private vs federal?

...

But I don't really know enough of the plan to be able to offer a more comprehensive answer, I just think that in principle the market has it's limitations.

It shows. It's actually the opposite here in America, as far as I can tell. The private sector just means someone has control over their money while if the federal government controls it, it means, well, you don't. That's one of the biggest issues I have with Obama vs. McCain and one in which I agree with the latter. Considering this election means a lot more to someone like my parents then it does to me, and this issue would more greatly affect them then me so I feel like I owe it to them more than myself or anyone to vote for whoever will benefit them the most. Sure, I agree with Obama on the more broad issues, but on a few of the bigger issues it seems to point towards McCain.

People should be responsible for their money, while always having a backdrop set up by the government, but it seems very hard to have things go both ways. You either control your retirement and risk the chance of losing it to someone or gaining more, or you don't control it at all, which I don't agree with at all.

Perhaps I am too ingrained with American "values" and am a capitalist pig, but I think complete government control of anything is a bad idea. The private sector is what makes America what it is. Unfortunately, in the last few years that has come with a negative connotation. The situation is sort of a catch-22, because one might say left to the private sector, everything would be taken over by greedy pigs, which is human nature. But if left in the hands of the government, it's also left to humans, and alas, greedy pigs. Though I do wish there was some way to have regulations on the private sector from federal and state governments, but then we're taking the morality of man for granted.

Written by akatana on 02.11.2008 at 19:46

What do you gain by controlling your retirement? Do you think you should be able to speculate with it in the market? Because if that is the case I don;t agree with you. I mean if you invest your retirement in a company and the company goes down before you retire you lost all your money. You cannot expect some backup from the state. So I don;t really get it why you agree with this.

That's what I am trying to say. If left to itself your retirement with be absolutely fine. But I think the person who earns that money should have the choice to do with it what they want. And most people don't invest 100% of their money in one company of the stock market or anything like that. It is quite a fluid and living entity, the stock market so you will never lose everything if you're smart about it. That's why I said people should be responsible, because it's either you get professionals to help and invest wisely or you lose everything and it's tough shit. But I wouldn't trust all my money in the hands of the government either. At least this way you have the choice, but alas the [/i]chance[/i] comes with it. I just don't agree with socialization in this aspect. I guess I'm just too American.

Written by akatana on 02.11.2008 at 20:00

I could agree with say a part of your retirement money being invested and in that way you would still ahve a decent level of backup even if your whole investment is lost.

This is what and how it is. Like I said, people don't invest all of their money in the private sector, that would be really ignorant, but having the ability to do so is a cornerstone of Capitalism and America. Having that choice is what I agree with more than having that security. So maybe you ask if there are capitalist pigs in government what choice will we have when monopolies take over? Well, that's where McCain's "superficially bad" idea of cutting taxes to big business come into play. If a business here in America who's paying 30%+ in taxes sees they can send work elsewhere, say, Ireland which has an 11% tax (example used by McCain) then they are going to do that. But if their taxes are lowered there is more of an initiative to stay here in the states and this would not only provide jobs, but the money spent on products would stay here, thus ideally boosting the economy. That, coupled with a revision of NAFTA to incorporate more "fair" trade over "free" trade would help us even more. While we shouldn't be afraid of globalization, we shouldn't let it control us either.

I wish we had a good Libertarian candidate, but Bob Barr sucks. I have no idea how he got the ticket.

Written by akatana on 02.11.2008 at 20:57

Unions are another form of protecting jobs. And there are many more. I say it again, the free-market principle which is held in such hight regard in america is not the answer to everything. The basic problem with it is that the market does not care about people, only profit. Think about it.

Exactly, this is why I said there should be more "fair" over "free" trade. Unfortunately, most people in power never seem to be "good at heart" so what's to say Obama or McCain will hold true to their word? I agree with your points. There should be regulation, but I also think tax breaks are incentives to stay here, even though, like you said, they are still shipping overseas. I can't stress fair trade enough. It's quite unfortunate I am unhappy with both candidates and as I feel I don't even want to vote.

Written by akatana on 02.11.2008 at 23:14

Written by Clintagräm on 02.11.2008 at 21:49

Written by akatana on 02.11.2008 at 20:57

Unions are another form of protecting jobs. And there are many more. I say it again, the free-market principle which is held in such hight regard in america is not the answer to everything. The basic problem with it is that the market does not care about people, only profit. Think about it.

Exactly, this is why I said there should be more "fair" over "free" trade. Unfortunately, most people in power never seem to be "good at heart" so what's to say Obama or McCain will hold true to their word? I agree with your points. There should be regulation, but I also think tax breaks are incentives to stay here, even though, like you said, they are still shipping overseas. I can't stress fair trade enough. It's quite unfortunate I am unhappy with both candidates and as I feel I don't even want to vote.

I can understand your disappointment but still I would vote if I were you. Even if the only reason would be to prevent the anti-science stupidity of palin to take over the white house.

Ha, yeah. Unfortunately I'm leaning more towards no vote. Even all the third parties blow. We'll see.

Okay I'll just throw in a one-liner here... but from my Dutch point of view it is just a choice between two evils.
So, I would say to anyone elligible to vote in the US, please vote for the lesser of the two evils.

Yesterday, I went to the court house to exercise my right as an American citizen to vote. I voted for Obama, by the way. Even though my vote for the Democratic nominee won't make a difference as I live in one of the reddest of red states (Kansas), at least I expressed my voice.

Written by [user id=5630] on 03.11.2008 at 00:27

Yesterday, I went to the court house to exercise my right as an American citizen to vote. I voted for Obama, by the way. Even though my vote for the Democratic nominee won't make a difference as I live in one of the reddest of red states (Kansas), at least I expressed my voice.

From the book "What's the Matter with Kansas: How Conservatives Won the Heart of America"

"Not long ago, Kansas would have responded to the current situation by making the bastards pay. This would have been a political certainty, as predictable as what happens when you touch a match to a puddle of gasoline. When business screwed the farmers and the workers - when it implemented monopoly strategies invasive beyond the Populists' furthest imaginings -- when it ripped off shareholders and casually tossed thousands out of work -- you could be damned sure about what would follow.
Not these days. Out here the gravity of discontent pulls in only one direction: to the right, to the right, further to the right. Strip today's Kansans of their job security, and they head out to become registered Republicans. Push them off their land, and next thing you know they're protesting in front of abortion clinics. Squander their life savings on manicures for the CEO, and there's a good chance they'll join the John Birch Society. But ask them about the remedies their ancestors proposed (unions, antitrust, public ownership), and you might as well be referring to the days when knighthood was in flower."

I've noticed that Metalstorm has a lot of ads for John McCain, whenever I visit this thread at least.
It must be the ad targeting system because when I visit the "Gaahl outs himself" thread I see a lot of ads for gay websites... XD

Written by Introspekrieg on 03.11.2008 at 01:08

From the book "What's the Matter with Kansas: How Conservatives Won the Heart of America"

"Not long ago, Kansas would have responded to the current situation by making the bastards pay. This would have been a political certainty, as predictable as what happens when you touch a match to a puddle of gasoline. When business screwed the farmers and the workers - when it implemented monopoly strategies invasive beyond the Populists' furthest imaginings -- when it ripped off shareholders and casually tossed thousands out of work -- you could be damned sure about what would follow.
Not these days. Out here the gravity of discontent pulls in only one direction: to the right, to the right, further to the right. Strip today's Kansans of their job security, and they head out to become registered Republicans. Push them off their land, and next thing you know they're protesting in front of abortion clinics. Squander their life savings on manicures for the CEO, and there's a good chance they'll join the John Birch Society. But ask them about the remedies their ancestors proposed (unions, antitrust, public ownership), and you might as well be referring to the days when knighthood was in flower."

Now that actually makes a lot of sense. This also reminds me of one time during my algebra class; when I told them that I would be voting for Obama, they all looked at me as if I killed someone in front of them.

Written by Introspekrieg on 03.11.2008 at 01:08

...when I visit the "Gaahl outs himself" thread I see a lot of ads for gay websites... XD

I lol'd. Of course, I have an adblocker, so I don't ever see those ads.