Written by The Melting Snow on 28.03.2015 at 08:13

Marco should've been used on a couple songs. Nightwish's female vocals have gone downright boring and aren't enough to carry the weight of a song. Dual vocals might do the trick.

PS. tried listening to the album again. not even a single verse or chorus has stuck with me, nor any instrumental part. Lyrics sound childish now. The rating just might go from 6 to 5.

I agree they should have used Marco more, but I found it very interesting that they had Marco sings more in the middle and low range and less of his trademark howling and then he and Troy sing together with Floor it at times almost sounds like a folk group. It goes very well with the overall musical style of the album. I think this is definitely their most folk oriented album and having Floor sing like a folk singer instead of a metal queen or opera star was a good choice. It also sounds like they mixed the vocal tracks to be at the same level as the music. This doesn't sound like they intended for the vocals to lead this album, but rather to be one more instrument. With the range and versatility of Floors voice I think it works. Just my opinion.

Written by Susan on 29.03.2015 at 00:03

I guess you didn't type slow enough because I still don't understand. Your response was to three reviews (so far just the 3 that I've seen) which all PRAISED Nightwish for growing and experimenting. Yet your comment is defensive about "reviewers" who don't "respect bands right to grow and experiment."

Huh?

Please type much, much slower.

This is definitely a first: he likes the album and yet is trying to argue with people who also like the album I've never seen this before in my years of observing forum trolls. Points for originality!

I'll have to get a new keyboard. This one doesn't go any slower... This is not about this review (my fault for not being clearer). This is about the forum posters who give their review of the album by comparing it to old work and saying, this is no Once or WIshmaster or whatever. No it isn't and it's unlikely any of their albums ever will be again. They've already done that. Some complain because they didn't have Floor pound out soprano, which they easily could have done to satisfy the Tarja-era fans. They got rid of Tarja, why would they replicate her? If they had put in a bunch of soprano would it have made the album better or just more like the old stuff ?

If the band doesn't grow they die. If Nightwish had never evolved from their first album their would be no Wishmaster, no Dark Passions Play, no Once, nothing but Angels Fall First. I find it odd people like the evolution right up until their favorite album, but if the band doesn't stop there they turn on them.

Nothing anybody says here will change one mind. They either listened and liked it or they didn't or they're somewhere in between. That's a personal thing, not a failure on Nightwish's part. They have a new singer and a chance to move forward. They'd be fools to stand still or go back. Just my opinion.

Written by Cynic Metalhead on 13.02.2015 at 13:21

Boo! Elan is piece of shit. I think I'll hardly go over and check out the full disc. Very very crappy song.

Don't mince words ... what did you really think

Written by Susan on 28.03.2015 at 02:51

Written by Steve Smith on 28.03.2015 at 01:23

I've been listening to this album pretty much none stop since I got it and one thing just amazes me. How angry Floors voice can sound when she 's doing grungy vocals like in Weak Fantasy. Awesome!:banger:

Thank you! That's my favorite song and I don't feel like it's getting enough attention. Floor sounds FIERCE here

I can hardly stop listening either. So digging the simple awesomeness.

I agree. Ferocious. Must see this live!!!!!!!

You can never please the Nightwish fanbase, can you?

Listened just past My Walden. Pretty boring so far, and sounds a bit lifeless. Hope the 2nd half is better, but so far I give it 6.5 (though probably closer to 6).

Get the 2 disc version if you can. I found the album was better without vocals. Plus there's a good bit right at the end of the instrumental disc.

This Steve guy is fun.

Steve, you are right. but Nightwish still sucks.

Written by Susan on 28.03.2015 at 22:06

I highly doubt Holopainen has the inclination to stoop that low with this but... shit, never underestimate the power of a crazed fan with nothing better to do.

Yeah, I don't see Holopainen as the kind of guy to do this either. Next theory: Steve Smith is an undercover record company rep.

I'd really like to participate in this discussion, but my 3CD Earbook doesn't arrive until sometime next week.

It's a good album. Aside from a pair tracks that add absolutely nothing and the title track which really gets on my nerves (I'm definitely removing this one from my future listens), the others are really strong tunes and I'm glad the way Floor's voice was used on the album contrary to the general opinion. Nightwish doesn't need Floor screaming all the time, they could just put Marco as a main vocalist for that. I really enjoy when she goes subtle as in Our Decades, even if the two best tracks are the monsters Weak Fantasy and Empty Hope

So finally I heard it, have been playing whole day
Mindblower, really a surprise
Funny according to Thoumas Elan was not be planned be into album, but its best song IMO
There are songs when you think ok strong album songs, but not like you want play more, but then comes some great song , or parts, what makes you spin this 'round 'n 'round.

Of corse true and great is '' Angels Fall Firts'' real gothic metal album
This is much better as Once, Wishmaster, much better as Dark Passion Play, Immaginarium

In others are weak songs, here weakest songs still are strong, I wont go back In nostalgia about old good days and Traja , I think even Annete would be capable sing into this. Marco Hietala vocal parts, maybe best what he has don after 80's Tarot albums?

If it would be bad Floor Jansen could save whit her singing, now she don't need
BTW song Alpenglow, isn't rip of of ''By By beautiful'' ?
I am impressed, good album indeed, I wish Floor was part of song writing process, but it don't change it. Old school whit new touch. Lyrics also are good, Thoumas did good there, really I am impressed ... play list for a week?

And Toumas Hollopainen was right, you need to listen album in its full from 1th to last song, and I always do, that's how you can understand it more..

Written by Unhealer on 29.03.2015 at 22:47

It's a good album. Aside from a pair tracks that add absolutely nothing and the title track which really gets on my nerves (I'm definitely removing this one from my future listens), the others are really strong tunes and I'm glad the way Floor's voice was used on the album contrary to the general opinion. Nightwish doesn't need Floor screaming all the time, they could just put Marco as a main vocalist for that. I really enjoy when she goes subtle as in Our Decades, even if the two best tracks are the monsters Weak Fantasy and Empty Hope

I really love the Weak Fantasy and Yours is an Empty Hope also. They never could have done those with the other two singers. They are fierce songs and Floor definitely brings that to the vocals. Neither Tarja nor Annette have the style training to cross the span of songs he wrote on this album. Everything Tarja sings she sounds opera. Ballad, thrasher or classical oriented she sounds the same. Just different levels of power. It's a good sound, but could you imagine her trying to do the folk numbers ..... yikes! It would be like writing opera for Annette. Floor is so versatile that if you didn't know would you have thought it was the same singer from Weak Fantasy to Elan and then back to Yours is an Empty Hope? Being naturally gifted isn't enough. She is also diversely trained an it shows. This has folk to metal to theatrical and every time her voice is dead on for the style. It probably also helps that she doesn''t sing with an accent like the other two.

Lovin it ....... Nice job guys. You finally hit the bullseye.

Written by sprozzata on 30.03.2015 at 02:28

Written by Unhealer on 29.03.2015 at 22:47

It's a good album. Aside from a pair tracks that add absolutely nothing and the title track which really gets on my nerves (I'm definitely removing this one from my future listens), the others are really strong tunes and I'm glad the way Floor's voice was used on the album contrary to the general opinion. Nightwish doesn't need Floor screaming all the time, they could just put Marco as a main vocalist for that. I really enjoy when she goes subtle as in Our Decades, even if the two best tracks are the monsters Weak Fantasy and Empty Hope

I really love the Weak Fantasy and Yours is an Empty Hope also. They never could have done those with the other two singers. They are fierce songs and Floor definitely brings that to the vocals. Neither Tarja nor Annette have the style training to cross the span of songs he wrote on this album. Everything Tarja sings she sounds opera. Ballad, thrasher or classical oriented she sounds the same. Just different levels of power. It's a good sound, but could you imagine her trying to do the folk numbers ..... yikes! It would be like writing opera for Annette. Floor is so versatile that if you didn't know would you have thought it was the same singer from Weak Fantasy to Elan and then back to Yours is an Empty Hope? Being naturally gifted isn't enough. She is also diversely trained an it shows. This has folk to metal to theatrical and every time her voice is dead on for the style. It probably also helps that she doesn''t sing with an accent like the other two.

Lovin it ....... Nice job guys. You finally hit the bullseye.

Sorry dude, forgot to mention her death growls in Empty Hope ........ SWEEEEEETTTTTTTT!!!!!! Anyone think the other two could have done that?

Between the opener totally mimicking Dark Chest Of Wonders and the total flatness of Elan, I was very concerned after a couple songs; however I ultimately found the rest of the album to be rather enjoyable. It's a bit baggy and is missing some real killer songs, but it's all fairly satisfying, more so than Imaginaerum and not too far off Once and Dark Passion Play, both albums that were less consistent than this one but which had some amazing songs to lift them just above this. Anyway, I'm not totally regretting buying a ticket to see them at Wembley any more.

Written by musclassia on 30.03.2015 at 22:11

Between the opener totally mimicking Dark Chest Of Wonders and the total flatness of Elan, I was very concerned after a couple songs; however I ultimately found the rest of the album to be rather enjoyable. It's a bit baggy and is missing some real killer songs, but it's all fairly satisfying, more so than Imaginaerum and not too far off Once and Dark Passion Play, both albums that were less consistent than this one but which had some amazing songs to lift them just above this. Anyway, I'm not totally regretting buying a ticket to see them at Wembley any more.

Sorry bro, but the opener exceeds Dark Chest of Wonders. Not a lemon on the tree. That's a first for these guys. This is a diverse, beautifully written, masterfully crafted and theatrically executed symphonic-celtic- folk-metal album (wow ... say that five times fast). I've only ever heard one album like it before. You know, an album that you like every song, but you can't pick a favorite. I have heard it at least 20 times and never once been tempted to skip a song. Now I know it's just how it affected me, but if this album doesn't do it for you I really hope everyone out there has one that does because it is the most amazing thing. Just to sit back, listen and let your mind go and when it's over ...... one more time!

Final answer ...... 10/10

Written by sprozzata on 01.04.2015 at 05:59

Sorry bro, but the opener exceeds Dark Chest of Wonders. Not a lemon on the tree. That's a first for these guys. This is a diverse, beautifully written, masterfully crafted and theatrically executed symphonic-celtic- folk-metal album (wow ... say that five times fast). I've only ever heard one album like it before. You know, an album that you like every song, but you can't pick a favorite. I have heard it at least 20 times and never once been tempted to skip a song. Now I know it's just how it affected me, but if this album doesn't do it for you I really hope everyone out there has one that does because it is the most amazing thing. Just to sit back, listen and let your mind go and when it's over ...... one more time!

Final answer ...... 10/10

To be honest, I just listened to both openers back to back, and I'd probably say the better one was the one that came first, which is Dark Chest, because they are unjustifiably similar - still, the songs are both good and there are some interesting things different in Shudder (although the song as a whole is something of a pastiche of previous NW songs). To be honest, I'm very glad that this album has made such an impact on you, and I assure you many albums have had such an effect on me before, but this is in no way one of them. Aside from the first couple tracks, the songs are all enjoyable, fairly well-written mixes of vocals, folk melodies and symphonic elements, with the guitars spending most of the time as background noise. Also, Shudder... isn't the only song that 'harks back' to previous songs; The Walden, which has a very pleasant folk breakdown in its second half, reminds me of a previous song I can't quite remember in its first half, and a couple other songs have a similar deja vu feeling. Honestly, it's better than Imaginaerum, but an album with the likes of the opener, Elan and Edema Rush can't hope to compare to their best albums like Oceanborn and Century Child in my opinion, and it doesn't have the truly great or memorable songs that Once (Nemo, Dark Chest and Ghost Love Score) and DPP (Poet and the Pendulum, Amaranth, Sahara) to match up to them.

Honestly, I'm very happy that this album inspires such happiness in you and I hope you continue to enjoy it to the same level, but for me, if I compared the band to Kamelot, I''d say Oceanborn thru Century Child represent the 'golden days' run of Karma thru Black Halo, Once translates to the decent but lower quality Ghost Opera, Imaginaerum to the disappointing Poetry of the Poisoned, and this album is like Silverthorn, a new album with a new singer that is promising for future work but by no means back up their with the best work yet.

I can see discussions slowly developing into the size of dissertation.

This sprozatta guy is Steve Smith's other account :p

made just to praise and comment over here

Written by The Melting Snow on 01.04.2015 at 21:02

This sprozatta guy is Steve Smith's other account :p

made just to praise and comment over here

Dude, I'm not hating you, but I can't understand. Why are you commenting so much on a album you find average, when people aren't even replying to you most of the times? Do you really feel that urge to state how average this album is to you, commenting here for a month and a half?

Ha ha

Written by Dark Forever on 01.04.2015 at 23:16

Written by The Melting Snow on 01.04.2015 at 21:02

This sprozatta guy is Steve Smith's other account :p

made just to praise and comment over here

Dude, I'm not hating you, but I can't understand. Why are you commenting so much on a album you find average, when people aren't even replying to you most of the times? Do you really feel that urge to state how average this album is to you, commenting here for a month and a half?

Good point. On the upside, if me and Steve are the same guy maybe he knows where my keys are

Written by musclassia on 01.04.2015 at 10:53

Written by sprozzata on 01.04.2015 at 05:59

Sorry bro, but the opener exceeds Dark Chest of Wonders. Not a lemon on the tree. That's a first for these guys. This is a diverse, beautifully written, masterfully crafted and theatrically executed symphonic-celtic- folk-metal album (wow ... say that five times fast). I've only ever heard one album like it before. You know, an album that you like every song, but you can't pick a favorite. I have heard it at least 20 times and never once been tempted to skip a song. Now I know it's just how it affected me, but if this album doesn't do it for you I really hope everyone out there has one that does because it is the most amazing thing. Just to sit back, listen and let your mind go and when it's over ...... one more time!

Final answer ...... 10/10

To be honest, I just listened to both openers back to back, and I'd probably say the better one was the one that came first, which is Dark Chest, because they are unjustifiably similar - still, the songs are both good and there are some interesting things different in Shudder (although the song as a whole is something of a pastiche of previous NW songs). To be honest, I'm very glad that this album has made such an impact on you, and I assure you many albums have had such an effect on me before, but this is in no way one of them. Aside from the first couple tracks, the songs are all enjoyable, fairly well-written mixes of vocals, folk melodies and symphonic elements, with the guitars spending most of the time as background noise. Also, Shudder... isn't the only song that 'harks back' to previous songs; The Walden, which has a very pleasant folk breakdown in its second half, reminds me of a previous song I can't quite remember in its first half, and a couple other songs have a similar deja vu feeling. Honestly, it's better than Imaginaerum, but an album with the likes of the opener, Elan and Edema Rush can't hope to compare to their best albums like Oceanborn and Century Child in my opinion, and it doesn't have the truly great or memorable songs that Once (Nemo, Dark Chest and Ghost Love Score) and DPP (Poet and the Pendulum, Amaranth, Sahara) to match up to them.

Honestly, I'm very happy that this album inspires such happiness in you and I hope you continue to enjoy it to the same level, but for me, if I compared the band to Kamelot, I''d say Oceanborn thru Century Child represent the 'golden days' run of Karma thru Black Halo, Once translates to the decent but lower quality Ghost Opera, Imaginaerum to the disappointing Poetry of the Poisoned, and this album is like Silverthorn, a new album with a new singer that is promising for future work but by no means back up their with the best work yet.

So what albums have? I'm always looking for new tunes.

Written by sprozzata on 02.04.2015 at 02:42

So what albums have? I'm always looking for new tunes.

"You know, an album that you like every song, but you can't pick a favorite. I have heard it at least 20 times and never once been tempted to skip a song."

I don't necessarily know what styles of metal or music in general outside of Nightwish appeal to you, or what experience you have, so it's quite possible that some of these you'll either already know or just have no interest in musically but a few albums where I like every song and haven't lost patience with after 20-odd plays:
Dream Theater - Images & Words; Kamelot - Black Halo; In Flames - Jester Race; Sylosis - Edge Of The Earth & Monolith; Opeth- Ghost Reveries amongst others; Agalloch - Ashes Against The Grain (aside from an interlude and random track at the end); Arcturus - Sham Mirrors; Green Carnation - Light Of Day, Day Of Darkness; Isis - Wavering Radiant and Panopticon; Tool - Lateralus, Protest The Hero - Kezia. Then there's a couple with one or two slightly lower-quality tracks, but where the rest of the album is so stellar you hardly notice, like Riverside - Second Life Syndrome, Mastodon - Leviathan, Down- NOLA and Alice In Chains - Dirt.

I could go on for longer but I feel like I've wittered enough with that list, and many of them might be barking up the wrong tree in terms of what interests you anyway, but just a few recs of albums that I consider almost nigh-on flawless, or are so excellent that any drops in quality that they have I just end up ignoring, and which have lasted the test of time as far as long-term appeal goes in my book. In terms of ones that might be similar to this, none of them are really symphonic albums, but Kamelot has some of the same epic bombast you might attribute to Nightwish, and Dream Theater and Arcturus are both primarily melodic and a tad flamboyant.

Written by Dark Forever on 01.04.2015 at 23:16

Written by The Melting Snow on 01.04.2015 at 21:02

This sprozatta guy is Steve Smith's other account :p

made just to praise and comment over here

Dude, I'm not hating you, but I can't understand. Why are you commenting so much on a album you find average, when people aren't even replying to you most of the times? Do you really feel that urge to state how average this album is to you, commenting here for a month and a half?

why do you want to understand? this is how i kill time at office, if you must know. also, you did just reply to me. -_-
you even checked the date of my first comment? oh boy, do we have a stalker here.

Lots of different personal fights here

ALL HAIL STEVE SMITH THE NIGHTWISH PROPHET!!!

Ch. 3 verse 18

Why would they go back to the "Tarja" era when they have enjoyed so much more popularity and freedom to create since they fired her? Look to the now and future. Yesterday is gone.

Ch. 7 verse 1

This is a new album. It is a work on it's own and it invalidates your review if you compare it to previous work. This is not a remake. It is a new story.

Ch. 12 verse 11

Thomas is the creator, the way, the truth, the light! Always was and always will be... Are you another closet "Tarja" worshipper who will never be happy until she's back and they are regurgitating the same songs they did 15 years ago? If so, I say destroy the infidel! Strike him down and smite the worshipers of the false Tarja religion!

Amen...

Lol but in all seriousness I enjoy the album.

It doesn't impress me nearly as much as Once and I was hoping for more complex and bombastic songs with a return to operatic singing but... throwing expectations out the door, its a decent album nonetheless. It's got nice melodies, it's catchy and the lyricism is actually pretty good and makes for a nice concept album, carrying you through song to song.

Despite Floor not being able to go all out, Floor at 10% is still miles better than Anette at 100%. And she does a nice job with the slight range of styles. This album is clearly all about simplicity, which is a bit ironic considering it's title/concept , personally I think it would've benefitted from some more complexity but taking it for what it is, it is still a very enjoyable listen and much better than the 90% of albums from the symphonic metal genre.

Did anyone ever consider that they are making the kind of music they enjoy making and playing? :p

Thats one of the main feelings this album gives me. And if thats true, im happy for them. They didnt call it a 'band'-album for no reason. I admit, the first listen didnt impress me, but no first listen ever impresses me. Ive had it playing in my car on the way to work, and caught myself humming Alpenglow later on. That means its a hit for me lol I loved Imaginaerum, but this is different. Its what it is, its Nightwish.. They are back, finally, and im so happy about it

Written by Litvin on 02.04.2015 at 00:53

Ha ha

Damn, that actually looks quite believable and classy.