Great review man! The album does has its moments but in general just drags on and kind of feels like a shore to listen to.

Written by AndreMarcos on 31.10.2017 at 01:47

Great review man! The album does has its moments but in general just drags on and kind of feels like a shore to listen to.

Thank you.

" the years-long soap opera As the World Turns Around Jari "

I agree with everything you write. Excellent review.

I agree, very good review. The guitars are nowhere to be found in the mix and the symphonic wankery is indeed enervating. I did find a few nice parts here and there though and "Loneliness" is awesome, I've played it a lot on its own skipping the other three tracks.

Very well written. You have a talent, man.

I'm happy to see so many positive comments for the review

Great job again, mate!

Amazing review, a bit my style review even not 100%. I will reject and regret years in my 20's when I liked grind, BDM, extreme music and any non sense extreme metal subgenre. This is better, fits in landscapes I mourn live and maybe will die. Mussicalöly its better as previos onebut nots o good as 1th bands album. Its lost in time somewhere between

Yes, maybe it was very little, for so many years of waiting. Even so the best point of this album are the lyrics. They are not worthy of a 6. Meanwhile, we will continue waiting for Time 2 to bring back the old wintersun and hopefully it will be a step towards a better wintersun.

Written by Kvothe on 01.11.2017 at 04:29

Yes, maybe it was very little, for so many years of waiting. Even so the best point of this album are the lyrics. They are not worthy of a 6. Meanwhile, we will continue waiting for Time 2 to bring back the old wintersun and hopefully it will be a step towards a better wintersun.

Such bands specially Nordic always has best lyrics when it comes nature, seasons, mountains, folklore, stories, not st. ann

I think the one thing Jari wants most is also the one thing bringing his band down: the best production. Already on Time I, which is songwriting-like a great album, the guitars were so small and thin and it all sounded more like a totally digitally-made album entirely based on Midi samples... I do understand that the music is very complex but there must be a better way than just to compress everything to death until it's a clean but monotonous rubbish.

I love Wintersun.

I really wanted to enjoy this album.

At least it's better than Ensiferum's new album.

Written by Bad English on 01.11.2017 at 10:02

Written by Kvothe on 01.11.2017 at 04:29

Yes, maybe it was very little, for so many years of waiting. Even so the best point of this album are the lyrics. They are not worthy of a 6. Meanwhile, we will continue waiting for Time 2 to bring back the old wintersun and hopefully it will be a step towards a better wintersun.

Such bands specially Nordic always has best lyrics when it comes nature, seasons, mountains, folklore, stories, not st. ann

If you only listen to the lyrics of Loneliless you understand the quality and the other songs also have incredible lyrics. Although in the musical aspect the seasons are not seen so well, and it lacks the essence of Wintersun, in the lyric it is the same perfection.

Written by Kvothe on 02.11.2017 at 21:47

Written by Bad English on 01.11.2017 at 10:02

Written by Kvothe on 01.11.2017 at 04:29

Yes, maybe it was very little, for so many years of waiting. Even so the best point of this album are the lyrics. They are not worthy of a 6. Meanwhile, we will continue waiting for Time 2 to bring back the old wintersun and hopefully it will be a step towards a better wintersun.

Such bands specially Nordic always has best lyrics when it comes nature, seasons, mountains, folklore, stories, not st. ann

If you only listen to the lyrics of Loneliless you understand the quality and the other songs also have incredible lyrics. Although in the musical aspect the seasons are not seen so well, and it lacks the essence of Wintersun, in the lyric it is the same perfection.

that's all what bands from north is all about.

Sorry neither this nor Time holds a candle to their debut.

To the reviewer: You should not be allowed to review kindergarten music shows if you believe this album is as bad as you described it. Their previous albums, while good on the music side, are nothing but just another power metal, which is the least creative genre after pure heavy metal. This album has amazing spirit, the so called blur into one miasma is called art, and you are obviously unqualified and way in over your head. This is, by far, their best album. Fanboys, get your heads out of your asses, yes, it is different to what you expected, but it is much better. I read here the same shit as when CoF released Hammer of the Witches. Because it is no longer what you expected it is a failure. Well guess what - this is not how real life works, neither how good music works. Failure after changing styles a bit - Trivium, In Flames, Metallica, etc. To put this along with the latter pile of smoking shit is a mockery and you should consider to craw back in your whole and listen to modern pop or some other talentless, musicless shit. I'm out!

Written by danielfilth88 on 27.11.2018 at 17:47

I'm out!

And there was much rejoicing.

Written by danielfilth88 on 27.11.2018 at 17:47

To the reviewer: You should not be allowed to review kindergarten music shows if you believe this album is as bad as you described it. Their previous albums, while good on the music side, are nothing but just another power metal, which is the least creative genre after pure heavy metal. This album has amazing spirit, the so called blur into one miasma is called art, and you are obviously unqualified and way in over your head. This is, by far, their best album. Fanboys, get your heads out of your asses, yes, it is different to what you expected, but it is much better. I read here the same shit as when CoF released Hammer of the Witches. Because it is no longer what you expected it is a failure. Well guess what - this is not how real life works, neither how good music works. Failure after changing styles a bit - Trivium, In Flames, Metallica, etc. To put this along with the latter pile of smoking shit is a mockery and you should consider to craw back in your whole and listen to modern pop or some other talentless, musicless shit. I'm out!

To the commenter: you should not be allowed to comment on other people's work if you believe this review is as bad as you implied it is.

Yes, my review makes much of the fact that The Forest Seasons doesn't sound like previous Wintersun; that is indeed one reason why I don't care for the album. That's not the only reason, however, and I said as much multiple times. I don't care that Wintersun changed their sound; Time I sounds little like Wintersun, after all, and I love both albums, so you can't argue that my distaste is purely the result of an inability to reconcile my expectations with what I heard on this album or that I can't adapt to the band's evolving sound. I don't like The Forest Seasons because it's almost entirely uninteresting to me. I don't find the songwriting all that engaging and the new styles they implemented don't appeal to me. You cannot validly claim that this is an incorrect assessment of the album.

I wouldn't describe myself as a fanboy at all. Of some bands, certainly, but not of Wintersun - not enough of a fan to be so tragically let down by the lack of a masterpiece according to my expectations that I'd run away and write a scathing review to take my revenge on Jari for not making the album I wanted and feel owed. You're allowed to think that this is their best album, but from my point of view, your comment makes you much more of a fanboy than me.

Moreover, making assertions about any genre being the "least creative" is a silly thing to do, since it's neither proof of any difference in quality nor very reliably proven. If you think that power metal, a genre that broadly houses such disparate acts as Blind Guardian, Iced Earth, Children of Bodom, Manowar, Avantasia, Orden Ogan, X Japan, Pathfinder, Manilla Road, Powerglove, Nekrogoblikon, and Outworld, is any less creative than, say, thrash, death, industrial, sludge, or folk, then I wonder what your criteria for "creativity" are (and how that even applies to anything here in the first place). Look at grindcore, symphonic, or "pure black metal," if we're allowed to purify our elements here. Are they substantially more "creative" than power metal? I'm also not sure how you can claim that Wintersun's previous two albums are run-of-the-mill power metal when (1) they're clearly more than your dime-a-dozen Helloween ripoff and (2) the debut, at least, is a landmark release in the extreme power genre.

I'll never understand people like you. I wrote a review in which I criticized an album - maybe harshly, but I don't think unnecessarily, and certainly not wantonly - and you receive my assessment as if I've made unsubstantiated accusations about your mother's profession and you come back at me with a completely ludicrous personal attack. Come back when you can defend your opinion with something a little more thoughtful than "you don't get it, this is art" and you can experience a difference of opinion without automatically concluding that the other party is not only egregiously in error but out to hinder your personal enjoyment. Guess what: this is not how real life works, nor is it how good music works.

You're out.

You have clearly stated that you dislike this album purely out of music preference - "new styles they implemented don't appeal to me". This is my argument. As I am not a fan of power metal that would never stop me from recognizing good music - you have mentioned quite a few bands that I like dearly - CoB, Iced Earth, who's album "Night of the Stormrider" got me into listening heavier music, taking on an instrument and eventually starting an amateur band, also Blind Guardian. The likes of Avantasia, Orden Ogan should not go in the same sentence as the others, but who am I to judge... If you see yourself as someone who is qualified and impartial enough to offer professional opinion on a band's work you should be objective. Even if you dislike every second of this album you should still give it music value credit. You even dumped on the production quality, which is simply confusing. I rarely get into such discussions, as they would lead nowhere - I don't see a version where the outcome is that one of us agrees with the other. By the way, the fanboy comment was not pointed at you. Points to me for you feeling it was though - we have a saying in my country ,which goes something like "The guilty would run even if nobody is chasing".

P.S. I visited a concert of Wintersun this year - a lot of people cried after they played this album, I cried. It has beauty that goes beyond your regular music listening. Most of the people in the crowd were musicians, by the way. The one guitar player who also cried took his band to Wacken 2015, to play, not to visit You have been excessively rude to this album and it is pure reflection on your preferences and nothing more - bad music, bad production, etc. It's not professional to go about ART reviews with such an attitude. I didn't read any of your other reviews, if they are all swayed by "my likey or not" I hope I never get to.

NOW I am out!

Written by Zap on 27.11.2018 at 23:35

Written by danielfilth88 on 27.11.2018 at 17:47

I'm out!

And there was much rejoicing.

Strong arguments. Good stuff, keep it up (y)

Written by ScreamingSteelUS on 28.11.2018 at 06:24

Written by danielfilth88 on 27.11.2018 at 17:47

To the reviewer: You should not be allowed to review kindergarten music shows if you believe this album is as bad as you described it. Their previous albums, while good on the music side, are nothing but just another power metal, which is the least creative genre after pure heavy metal. This album has amazing spirit, the so called blur into one miasma is called art, and you are obviously unqualified and way in over your head. This is, by far, their best album. Fanboys, get your heads out of your asses, yes, it is different to what you expected, but it is much better. I read here the same shit as when CoF released Hammer of the Witches. Because it is no longer what you expected it is a failure. Well guess what - this is not how real life works, neither how good music works. Failure after changing styles a bit - Trivium, In Flames, Metallica, etc. To put this along with the latter pile of smoking shit is a mockery and you should consider to craw back in your whole and listen to modern pop or some other talentless, musicless shit. I'm out!

To the commenter: you should not be allowed to comment on other people's work if you believe this review is as bad as you implied it is.

Yes, my review makes much of the fact that The Forest Seasons doesn't sound like previous Wintersun; that is indeed one reason why I don't care for the album. That's not the only reason, however, and I said as much multiple times. I don't care that Wintersun changed their sound; Time I sounds little like Wintersun, after all, and I love both albums, so you can't argue that my distaste is purely the result of an inability to reconcile my expectations with what I heard on this album or that I can't adapt to the band's evolving sound. I don't like The Forest Seasons because it's almost entirely uninteresting to me. I don't find the songwriting all that engaging and the new styles they implemented don't appeal to me. You cannot validly claim that this is an incorrect assessment of the album.

I wouldn't describe myself as a fanboy at all. Of some bands, certainly, but not of Wintersun - not enough of a fan to be so tragically let down by the lack of a masterpiece according to my expectations that I'd run away and write a scathing review to take my revenge on Jari for not making the album I wanted and feel owed. You're allowed to think that this is their best album, but from my point of view, your comment makes you much more of a fanboy than me.

Moreover, making assertions about any genre being the "least creative" is a silly thing to do, since it's neither proof of any difference in quality nor very reliably proven. If you think that power metal, a genre that broadly houses such disparate acts as Blind Guardian, Iced Earth, Children of Bodom, Manowar, Avantasia, Orden Ogan, X Japan, Pathfinder, Manilla Road, Powerglove, Nekrogoblikon, and Outworld, is any less creative than, say, thrash, death, industrial, sludge, or folk, then I wonder what your criteria for "creativity" are (and how that even applies to anything here in the first place). Look at grindcore, symphonic, or "pure black metal," if we're allowed to purify our elements here. Are they substantially more "creative" than power metal? I'm also not sure how you can claim that Wintersun's previous two albums are run-of-the-mill power metal when (1) they're clearly more than your dime-a-dozen Helloween ripoff and (2) the debut, at least, is a landmark release in the extreme power genre.

I'll never understand people like you. I wrote a review in which I criticized an album - maybe harshly, but I don't think unnecessarily, and certainly not wantonly - and you receive my assessment as if I've made unsubstantiated accusations about your mother's profession and you come back at me with a completely ludicrous personal attack. Come back when you can defend your opinion with something a little more thoughtful than "you don't get it, this is art" and you can experience a difference of opinion without automatically concluding that the other party is not only egregiously in error but out to hinder your personal enjoyment. Guess what: this is not how real life works, nor is it how good music works.

You're out.

I just saw you like Sabaton. This is more than enough to conclude you have no authority to even comment on the aforementioned kindergarten shows. Get a job. Another job!

Written by danielfilth88 on 27.11.2018 at 17:47

Fanboys, get your heads out of your asses
you should consider to craw back in your whole

Written by danielfilth88 on 28.11.2018 at 19:24

I've got a lovely bunch of coconuts

The fact that you are not a power metal fan allows you to be a fan of a power metal album, whereas the fact that I am a power metal fan means that I am too subjective to understand a great power metal album when I hear one? I, too, am able to take pleasure in art that falls outside my usual preferences, but that doesn't mean that the odd hip-hop artist or romance movie that I do enjoy is automatically the best in its field because someone such as I happened to enjoy it and therefore there must be a universally recognizable quality to it - it just means that it appealed to me on a personal level for some reason. The fact that you love The Forest Seasons despite not being a big power metal fan doesn't mean that The Forest Seasons is inherently superior to all other power metal; it just means that you liked it more. That's fine. You don't have to justify your appreciation by delegitimizing everyone who disagrees.

I didn't realize that your criticism of my review was actually predicated on the assertion that I'm not being objective enough to write reviews in a professional setting. I was hoping that people had stopped making this absurd argument. Well, I do apologize for not being Impartialthony Objectano, musical attorney at law, but I've never really considered myself "qualified" to "offer [a] professional opinion" on anything. I write reviews because it's fun and I'm only doing so in such a professional capacity because I kept doing it, I can string two sentences together, and I know how to keep promos to myself. I didn't go to Juliliard, so I can't offer you a formal, technical assessment of everything The Forest Seasons does on an atomic level, but I listen to a lot of metal, so I can tell you that this bored me. Sorry if I'm not professional enough, but, hey, you're not really looking for professionalism anyway. You're looking for confirmation of your own opinion from a source that you can take as divinely inspired, which I can't offer you. You want somebody to validate your appreciation. Here you go: you're allowed to like this album as much as you want.

Look, if you want a completely objective, unbiased, impersonal, impartial packet of information, then you don't want a review of an album. You want a description of an album. I'm not here to dispense the dictionary definition for The Forest Seasons. My job as the reviewer is to tell you what I thought of it and what I think you can expect based on what I heard. I did that.

Art is not objective. Discussions of art can in certain regards be objective, but a critic's review is not going to be objective; it's going to be colored by that critic's tastes and cultural/personal context and reception of the work. I don't even refer to myself as a "critic," because I'm just some random guy who writes reviews on the internet; if history's great critics (how many of those are there?) necessarily fall victim to subjectivity, then what chance do I stand? And what gives you the right to dismiss the bands I listed as not worthy of mention next to the almighty, unflappable Wintersun? What if I told you that X Japan's Art of Life, Manilla Road's Crystal Logic, Orden Ogan's To the End, and Manowar's Hail to England are all objectively better than The Forest Seasons to the extreme and there's nothing you can do to prove otherwise? This is a ludicrous game.

I've seen Wintersun several times on previous tours. They're a great live band. I'm glad, without the slightest hint of irony, that you were able to experience something so personally meaningful. I, too, have gotten the chance to attend concerts that transcended the usual bounds of music listening, and it's an experience like no other. For me, those were at shows of artists like Sabaton, Devin Townsend, Warning, and Eluveitie. Judging by your revulsion at the appearance of Sabaton in my favorites list, you're probably not terribly impressed by this - but I see Suicide Silence is the only band listed in yours, and I despise them. Does that matter? Not in the slightest.

Does it matter that "a crowd full of musicians" loves this album? No. Does it matter that somebody who played Wacken likes this album? No. Being in a band doesn't make you more qualified to judge music. Given the number of bands out there that suck, I should think that that's obvious. Does it make sense for you to lecture somebody about professionalism while being a condescending brickhead? No.

We have a saying in my country: "We saved yer ass in World War II." Is that relevant, or even true? No, but then again, neither is any of the stuff you said.

Also, Wintersun? Professional? It is to laugh.

Keep going.

Written by ScreamingSteelUS on 29.11.2018 at 01:32

Written by danielfilth88 on 28.11.2018 at 19:24

I've got a lovely bunch of coconuts

The fact that you are not a power metal fan allows you to be a fan of a power metal album, whereas the fact that I am a power metal fan means that I am too subjective to understand a great power metal album when I hear one? I, too, am able to take pleasure in art that falls outside my usual preferences, but that doesn't mean that the odd hip-hop artist or romance movie that I do enjoy is automatically the best in its field because someone such as I happened to enjoy it and therefore there must be a universally recognizable quality to it - it just means that it appealed to me on a personal level for some reason. The fact that you love The Forest Seasons despite not being a big power metal fan doesn't mean that The Forest Seasons is inherently superior to all other power metal; it just means that you liked it more. That's fine. You don't have to justify your appreciation by delegitimizing everyone who disagrees.

I didn't realize that your criticism of my review was actually predicated on the assertion that I'm not being objective enough to write reviews in a professional setting. I was hoping that people had stopped making this absurd argument. Well, I do apologize for not being Impartialthony Objectano, musical attorney at law, but I've never really considered myself "qualified" to "offer [a] professional opinion" on anything. I write reviews because it's fun and I'm only doing so in such a professional capacity because I kept doing it, I can string two sentences together, and I know how to keep promos to myself. I didn't go to Juliliard, so I can't offer you a formal, technical assessment of everything The Forest Seasons does on an atomic level, but I listen to a lot of metal, so I can tell you that this bored me. Sorry if I'm not professional enough, but, hey, you're not really looking for professionalism anyway. You're looking for confirmation of your own opinion from a source that you can take as divinely inspired, which I can't offer you. You want somebody to validate your appreciation. Here you go: you're allowed to like this album as much as you want.

Look, if you want a completely objective, unbiased, impersonal, impartial packet of information, then you don't want a review of an album. You want a description of an album. I'm not here to dispense the dictionary definition for The Forest Seasons. My job as the reviewer is to tell you what I thought of it and what I think you can expect based on what I heard. I did that.

Art is not objective. Discussions of art can in certain regards be objective, but a critic's review is not going to be objective; it's going to be colored by that critic's tastes and cultural/personal context and reception of the work. I don't even refer to myself as a "critic," because I'm just some random guy who writes reviews on the internet; if history's great critics (how many of those are there?) necessarily fall victim to subjectivity, then what chance do I stand? And what gives you the right to dismiss the bands I listed as not worthy of mention next to the almighty, unflappable Wintersun? What if I told you that X Japan's Art of Life, Manilla Road's Crystal Logic, Orden Ogan's To the End, and Manowar's Hail to England are all objectively better than The Forest Seasons to the extreme and there's nothing you can do to prove otherwise? This is a ludicrous game.

I've seen Wintersun several times on previous tours. They're a great live band. I'm glad, without the slightest hint of irony, that you were able to experience something so personally meaningful. I, too, have gotten the chance to attend concerts that transcended the usual bounds of music listening, and it's an experience like no other. For me, those were at shows of artists like Sabaton, Devin Townsend, Warning, and Eluveitie. Judging by your revulsion at the appearance of Sabaton in my favorites list, you're probably not terribly impressed by this - but I see Suicide Silence is the only band listed in yours, and I despise them. Does that matter? Not in the slightest.

Does it matter that "a crowd full of musicians" loves this album? No. Does it matter that somebody who played Wacken likes this album? No. Being in a band doesn't make you more qualified to judge music. Given the number of bands out there that suck, I should think that that's obvious. Does it make sense for you to lecture somebody about professionalism while being a condescending brickhead? No.

We have a saying in my country: "We saved yer ass in World War II." Is that relevant, or even true? No, but then again, neither is any of the stuff you said.

Also, Wintersun? Professional? It is to laugh.

Actually I have no idea how Suicide silence got on a list, that I never started to fill. Among my favorites, if it matters, are Death, Inferi, Sylosis, Lamb of God, Vader (earlier work), Atlantis Chronicles, Ouroboros, Deicide, Amon Amarth, Iced Earth, Shadow of Intent, etc. Forest Seasons is MUCH closer to atmospheric black than power, I believe you will not be arguing that.

To dismiss my whole comment as having irrelevant arguments is completely stupid. Instead of presenting your own you have gone all "Trump" and "fake news" on me. How is you seeing yourself in my words, which were not directed at you, not relevant to "The guilty will run even when not chased"? And THANK MIGHT GOD that you had nothing to do with "saving" us And yes, it matters if a crowd full of musicians is so touched by certain music. as they have valid grounds to judge it. So far you are just somebody who managed to master the skill of writing to a certain extent and you have no other grounds to support your opinion. Critics and self-proclaimed reviewers are people who are either too lazy to try to master an instrument, or too talentless to do so when they try. This is why most of the reviewers are often bitter, sad men. You call Wintersun unprofessional, while offering this nicely wrapped pile of nonsense. And my band does suck. But we are amateurs, I do this for fun, stress relief and it is a great hobby. I am not near being a musician and nowhere near qualified enough to offer my shit of opinion on other people's hard work. Neither should you. Especially when it is completely wrong, unjust and seriously weak. 6 on production? What have you been listening to up until now?

P.S. It does matter what musicians think of an album, not because they are always right, but because they have gazillion times more grounds to offer opinion than you. What you do is sit at home and troll whenever you can on the net. "I listen to a lot of music" Shit! Me too! I should review some albums...

P.P.S. Judging Forest Seasons for lack of creativity while having Sabaton as one of your favorites only proves my every word. Sabaton have written one riff, 1 drum set and 2 bass lines. Cheers to them for managing to make a career out of it. Saw them live this year as well. I'd rather listen to my 89 year old neighbor with bad bowel movement trying to take a shit. A bunch of people walked out on the concert and Sabaton were headliners. Such serious lack of any creativity I've only seen on a white piece of paper. But did I go online to shit on their albums - no. Why? 'Cause I know better, that's why!

I thought you said you were "out?" Oh wait, you were just being a drama queen.

As someone who has been playing guitar for over 15 years my word is law and I declare this album pretty shit. I also have a degree in audio engineering so I feel that I can rightfully declare the production on this album pretty shit. I also have some basic drumming skills so I can comfortably comment on all the instrumentation. And since I have been known to sing in the shower from time to time I won't hesitate to judge Jari's singing. I am therefore the most objective reviewer on this site.

Written by danielfilth88 on 29.11.2018 at 16:47

Written by ScreamingSteelUS on 29.11.2018 at 01:32

Written by danielfilth88 on 28.11.2018 at 19:24

I've got a lovely bunch of coconuts

Romanes eunt domus

No, Donny, these men are nihilists.

Administrative note: trim your quotes. These responses are long enough without unnecessary roughage.

First of all, I dismissed your comment as having irrelevant arguments after I responded to those arguments. You have managed not to respond to many of mine.

It doesn't matter what your favorite bands are. It doesn't matter what my favorite bands are, either. I happen to love Sabaton, yes. "Ghost Division" is a real corker the likes of which The Forest Seasons cannot offer. I could give you a laundry list of other bands that I listen to that might impress you more than Sabaton, but I shouldn't have to because the fact that I also love Melt-Banana, Kypck, Rigor Mortis, Atheist, and Thrawsunblat has no bearing on my qualifications to have and express an opinion about Wintersun. In case you're looking for more ammunition, though, I'll just slip in that I'm a big fan of the Ramones and I'm also fond of AC/DC, Motorhead, Slayer, and probably a hundred other bands best known for continually inventing the same wheel.

The Forest Seasons is extreme power. It does occasionally have some elements of atmospheric black, but on the whole I'd call it more in line with extreme power than anything else. This album is much closer to Ensiferum, Children of Bodom, Kalmah, Whispered, and Norther than Summoning, Drudkh, Saor, Downfall of Nur, and Falls of Rauros. Why are we arguing about the genre of the album anyway?

I'll tell you again that being a musician doesn't matter. I'm a musician, too. I play guitar, I play saxophone, and I sing. That good enough for you? Musicians have valid grounds to judge music - but so does everyone else. Musicians can be wrong. Musicians wrote Lulu, Illud Divinum Insanus, and Dedicated to Chaos. Musicians continue to extol the virtues of KISS, who make Sabaton look like John Zorn. In fact, if I may fight fire by lighting myself on fire, how many musicians do you suppose there are in the fan base of Sabaton? Musicians are just people. They aren't gods who have been granted an eternal +3 to Appreciate Music. Maybe a musician can understand the creative process better, can put into clearer terms the technical components of a composition, can hear something in a different way from other listeners - but so what? That doesn't make their assessment more valid than a listener who isn't a musician. That doesn't necessarily mean that a musician can enjoy or understand a song to any greater or lesser extent than any other listener, because music doesn't exist purely on a formal level - it exists on an emotional, contextual, and subjective level that vastly outweighs any objective consideration. It's like saying you have to direct movies to understand them or you have to write books in order to read them.

Maybe I don't have any grounds to support my opinion other than the fact that I can write "to a certain extent" and I listen to music (and I'm a musician, which increases my IQ by 40 points and gives me advantage on Charisma saving throws). What grounds do you have to support your opinion? The fact that you have the ability to write negative comments on the internet? Where's your evidence to support your assertion that critics and reviewers are miserable failures who only talk about music because they can't make music? If it's okay that your band sucks because you just do it for fun and for stress relief, why isn't it okay that I write reviews for fun and for stress relief? Because I'm putting my work into a public forum? You can do the same thing, and even Jari is welcome to come to this website and write his own review. I call Wintersun more unprofessional than me because I took less than eight years to publish my review AND I published the whole thing at once. And I'll have you know, you cheeky honored guest, that my bitter sadness has nothing to do with music, thank you very much.

As for your cohort of concertgoing straw men there, what group of people is most likely to attend a Wintersun concert? Wintersun fans. What group of people is most likely to agree with you and like The Forest Seasons? Wintersun fans. I think you found yourself in an echo chamber. If I were there, I'd probably have a great time even if I don't care for the album all that much. It's a live setting. People have fun there.

If you're this put out by the fact that a fellow human does not share your specific level of appreciation for a particular album, then show me how it's done. Do what you facetiously suggested: write and submit an impartial, objective review of this album and I will proofread it and have it published on this website. And I don't mean to say, "Oh yeah? Well, let's see you write a review if you're so smart!" I mean that I want you to demonstrate precisely what you think a review should look like with absolutely no subjective language whatsoever.

If you really are "nowhere near qualified enough to offer [your] shit of opinion on other people's hard work", then stop criticizing my review.

THANK MIGHT GOD indeed.

This is so much fun, I'll just pour some more gasoline into the fire

a) As much as I hate to say it, the Americans did save our asses in WWII. The Russians did a very good job too. Of course, the mistakes that Hitler made, being the narcissistic psychopath with delusions of grandeur that he was, helped a lot.
b) SSUS's reviews are 99% of the time spot on, even though he has major character flaws such as being a fan of Sabaton and all.
c) On the other hand, let's not forget that he rated the latest Babymetal with a 9 so how does he dare review a tr00 metal album like The Forest Seasons??? It's preposterous!
d) danielfilth88 can write his own review just like anybody on this website, but it will never be as good as mine because I have been listening to this music for about 30 years and therefore only my opinion is valid.
e) There is no god so it's pointless to thank an imaginary person for anything.
f) I can think of something better to do for fun and stress relief but it seems some people are not getting any. Most people who attack reviewers are insecure and illiterate creatures who live in their mother's basement and can't put two and two together. I am a psychologist so I can draw conclusions and make generalisations like that just by reading someone's thoughts on the internet.
g) I went to a Robbie Williams concert a couple of years ago. I cried when he played "Angels". Everyone around me was crying too. The riot police were using tear gas because a bunch of people were trying to get in without a ticket.
h) Who the fuck even cares that much apart from butthurt fanboys?
i) I'm out! (but only until I get back in)

Written by nikarg on 30.11.2018 at 13:24

[...]
g) I went to a Robbie Williams concert a couple of years ago. I cried when he played "Angels". Everyone around me was crying too. The riot police were using tear gas because a bunch of people were trying to get in without a ticket.
[...]

You made my day. Thanks!

Written by ScreamingSteelUS on 30.11.2018 at 06:03

Written by danielfilth88 on 29.11.2018 at 16:47

Written by ScreamingSteelUS on 29.11.2018 at 01:32

Written by danielfilth88 on 28.11.2018 at 19:24

I've got a lovely bunch of coconuts

Romanes eunt domus

No, Donny, these men are nihilists.

Administrative note: trim your quotes. These responses are long enough without unnecessary roughage.

First of all, I dismissed your comment as having irrelevant arguments after I responded to those arguments. You have managed not to respond to many of mine.

It doesn't matter what your favorite bands are. It doesn't matter what my favorite bands are, either. I happen to love Sabaton, yes. "Ghost Division" is a real corker the likes of which The Forest Seasons cannot offer. I could give you a laundry list of other bands that I listen to that might impress you more than Sabaton, but I shouldn't have to because the fact that I also love Melt-Banana, Kypck, Rigor Mortis, Atheist, and Thrawsunblat has no bearing on my qualifications to have and express an opinion about Wintersun. In case you're looking for more ammunition, though, I'll just slip in that I'm a big fan of the Ramones and I'm also fond of AC/DC, Motorhead, Slayer, and probably a hundred other bands best known for continually inventing the same wheel.

The Forest Seasons is extreme power. It does occasionally have some elements of atmospheric black, but on the whole I'd call it more in line with extreme power than anything else. This album is much closer to Ensiferum, Children of Bodom, Kalmah, Whispered, and Norther than Summoning, Drudkh, Saor, Downfall of Nur, and Falls of Rauros. Why are we arguing about the genre of the album anyway?

I'll tell you again that being a musician doesn't matter. I'm a musician, too. I play guitar, I play saxophone, and I sing. That good enough for you? Musicians have valid grounds to judge music - but so does everyone else. Musicians can be wrong. Musicians wrote Lulu, Illud Divinum Insanus, and Dedicated to Chaos. Musicians continue to extol the virtues of KISS, who make Sabaton look like John Zorn. In fact, if I may fight fire by lighting myself on fire, how many musicians do you suppose there are in the fan base of Sabaton? Musicians are just people. They aren't gods who have been granted an eternal +3 to Appreciate Music. Maybe a musician can understand the creative process better, can put into clearer terms the technical components of a composition, can hear something in a different way from other listeners - but so what? That doesn't make their assessment more valid than a listener who isn't a musician. That doesn't necessarily mean that a musician can enjoy or understand a song to any greater or lesser extent than any other listener, because music doesn't exist purely on a formal level - it exists on an emotional, contextual, and subjective level that vastly outweighs any objective consideration. It's like saying you have to direct movies to understand them or you have to write books in order to read them.

Maybe I don't have any grounds to support my opinion other than the fact that I can write "to a certain extent" and I listen to music (and I'm a musician, which increases my IQ by 40 points and gives me advantage on Charisma saving throws). What grounds do you have to support your opinion? The fact that you have the ability to write negative comments on the internet? Where's your evidence to support your assertion that critics and reviewers are miserable failures who only talk about music because they can't make music? If it's okay that your band sucks because you just do it for fun and for stress relief, why isn't it okay that I write reviews for fun and for stress relief? Because I'm putting my work into a public forum? You can do the same thing, and even Jari is welcome to come to this website and write his own review. I call Wintersun more unprofessional than me because I took less than eight years to publish my review AND I published the whole thing at once. And I'll have you know, you cheeky honored guest, that my bitter sadness has nothing to do with music, thank you very much.

As for your cohort of concertgoing straw men there, what group of people is most likely to attend a Wintersun concert? Wintersun fans. What group of people is most likely to agree with you and like The Forest Seasons? Wintersun fans. I think you found yourself in an echo chamber. If I were there, I'd probably have a great time even if I don't care for the album all that much. It's a live setting. People have fun there.

If you're this put out by the fact that a fellow human does not share your specific level of appreciation for a particular album, then show me how it's done. Do what you facetiously suggested: write and submit an impartial, objective review of this album and I will proofread it and have it published on this website. And I don't mean to say, "Oh yeah? Well, let's see you write a review if you're so smart!" I mean that I want you to demonstrate precisely what you think a review should look like with absolutely no subjective language whatsoever.

If you really are "nowhere near qualified enough to offer [your] shit of opinion on other people's hard work", then stop criticizing my review.

THANK MIGHT GOD indeed.

You know, up until the 4th paragraph you actually had me thinking "maybe I was wrong, he made valid points and I would be a bigot not to accept them". But then you went ahead and ruined it with passive-aggressiveness and butt hurt behavior. Really? Is this the first negative comment you get? How long have you been doing this? You are asking me to stop criticizing your work, the work that took whole FEW HOURS to compile, listening to the album included. Next to the 8 years you took as a bullet in your chamber...Good job, mate!

It is OK that my band sucks, because I am not using it to disproof other people's much harder work and much more dedication and creativity (like you do with your "hard" work). I'll give you that - you are quite the wordsmith. Cheers! i am not, though. Inviting me to write a review so you can post it, destroy it and feel better about yourself later only shows weakness and paints how annoyed I got you. It is like Marty Friedman or Chuck Schuldiner inviting you to a guitar brodown so they can destroy you and "prove" they are better. Especially when you specifically said that you do not wish to play the guitar at all Which I did - I did say I do not want to even be close to reviewing any album, no matter if positive or negative review is at hand.

I am not expecting you to like the album, I am not annoyed because you don't like it! I don't care what you like or don't. What bothered me is the extent to which you shit on it. It is unfair, it is completely incorrect and not even close to the truth. The "it will fork your eyes out" kind of obvious truth. If you are honest about being impartial about this it only means you suck at writing reviews due to having close to 0 music hearing. Let this be our final exchange of comments, it is pointless. You have some valid points, I spoke out of emotion in few of my sentences and we will not see eye to eye anytime soon. If you feel the need to continue this discussion so you find yourself firmly at the top of it, by all means do so. I read enough, I found what I was looking for in the latter comments. If you are interested in what it was - that this review was written by an incompetent reviewer with nice word skills. Maybe you should be a journalist, you certainly have the skill and mainstream journalism does not care for the truth, so you will have a shining career.

P.S. Jari's morning piss sounds are better than anything Sabaton ever did. Even David Dreimann would agree with that.