After let's say, 7th listen we're presented with the full understanding of this phenomenal piece of gothic metal. And what a ethereal and beautiful trip it is !
I have to do a serious warning to the detractors. If at first you do not like do not troll about it. Far from being accessible or simple (it's the opposite in reality) this is the Draconian album more difficult to entrench but after it "possess" you the reward is simply divine. Simply phenomenal. Simply Beautiful. And your soul is doomed to a new level of understanding of Draconian. The apocalypse is here. There is no coming back from this.

Now I really am sure it's not the worst of Draconian works. It is totally at the previous levels.

And Lisa is just a phenomenal singer, her voice is pure and sweet and super melodic. Comparing her with Sharon of WT is pure heresy.

To Behdad K2 , treat Marcel's opinion like I do... Newspaper... He just don't get It and never will. Waiting for your review

Written by Vonpire on 30.06.2011 at 13:52

To Behdad K2 , treat Marcel's opinion like I do... Newspaper... He just don't get It and never will. Waiting for your review

Marcel's hate of Draconian is not a new thing!
From the very first moments being in this forum, I remember Marcel hating Draconian and saying Lisa is not a good singer, while I think she is simply the best singer.
How can someone listen to "The Drowning Age" and say her voice 'doesn't fit'?! Just give me a definition of 'fit'! Lol!

I had higher expectations.Their older stuff never disapointed me, but this one ....
In fact , it was NOT a bad or weak efford, but when it comes to Draconian, I always expect a really really FANTASTIC album.

I think End Of The Rope was the best one.

Let me just ask you one question... How many times did you listened to it as a whole?

Thanks for your opinion.

Written by Vonpire on 30.06.2011 at 13:52

After let's say, 7th listen we're presented with the full understanding of this phenomenal piece of gothic metal. And what a ethereal and beautiful trip it is !
I have to do a serious warning to the detractors. If at first you do not like do not troll about it.

Oh thank you mister elite listener who hovers above us, unworthy maggots; whose ability to fathom the bottomless depth of Draconian's genius surpasses ours by so much, that we look like wretched ants privy to your gargantuan greatness!

Ok, enough sarcasm, a serious question instead - is your arrogance serious, or are you just being pompous after lunch?

Written by Vonpire on 30.06.2011 at 13:52

And Lisa is just a phenomenal singer, her voice is pure and sweet and super melodic. Comparing her with Sharon of WT is pure heresy.

Except that they sound very much alike? I'd say it's a compliment to be compared to Sharon who, quality of her band aside, is a great singer without doubt.

Written by Behdaad on 30.06.2011 at 13:40

I think leaving such comments "Draconian suck" or so, is no appropriate behavior.
And a more important question: Is it okay just to say "Draconian suck" in the topic of their new album where their fans read?
Maybe I hate a lot of bands, but I never just stand there and shout "Hey! I hate that band! They suck!" in the middle of their fans!

What? Don't go with that argument here. Marcel and I gave plenty of reasons to why we didn'ät like the album. There's nothing wrong with that. I agree that people who just write "This sucks" are just spammers but we gave REASONS for our opinion.

WTF?

I am arrogant? Look yourself at the mirror.

If you didn't got It I am just saying that this is a album that takes time to understand. If you didn't got It your bad. I already said that the first time I listened It I would have rated it with a 7 or 8. But you should have missed It. Want to troll about It, Be my guest.

Maybe to your ears they sound alike. In my ears Lisa has nothing to do with Sharon. But again what do I know huh?

Out of this, I don't need to hear this kind of shits, specially coming from where they come. What a beautiful staff we have here... Go make sweet love

Bye.

EDIT : Oh wait, now I remember, you guys are always paired, like the girls when they go to the bathroom. I remember the COF review and comments...

Isn't that really lame??

Written by Vonpire on 30.06.2011 at 14:44

I am arrogant? Look yourself at the mirror.

I can't, because I can't fall asleep afterwards.

Lol, that one was nice I agree



You can always use a mask, huh?

Mr. Doctor - "Marcel and I gave plenty of reasons to why we didn't like the album" - Really? Where are they? I can only see Female Vocals don't fit and it's too very accesible. But maybe it's me who's needing glasses and don't know...

Come on Vonpire, I don't like this argument. Please stop it.

Written by Vonpire on 30.06.2011 at 14:55

Mr. Doctor - "Marcel and I gave plenty of reasons to why we didn't like the album" - Really? Where are they? I can only see Female Vocals don't fit and it's too very accesible. But maybe it's me who's needing glasses and don't know...

And even if they were the only reasons... No one can say that we just wrote spam and posted "Draconian suck" like a troll. No one did that but that comment wasn't amined at you but the one who started to talk about such trolls that post one line "x band rocks/sucks".

If you wanted more: I dont really like their music because I don't feel anything while listening to it. I wasn't the one who said the female vocals were ba, Marcel did... I on the other hand have problems with the growls which are totally unispired (I wrote this before btw)
In the end... who needs 10 reasons to not like a band? If you don't feel anyuthing while listening to them, that's more than enough. I gave some other reasons though but in the end it's just a matter of tastes.

What I don't allow is when someone says that I just posted "X band sucks" because that's far from the truth.

I am not on this topic anymore. This is last post it really Is. I know some of them will try to make it not be but I'll answer by pm if really pricked...

Over and out.

EDIT : elite, élite [ɪˈliːt eɪ-]
n
1. (sometimes functioning as plural) the most powerful, rich, gifted, or educated members of a group, community, etc.

Buhahahahahaha, poor you

"This time out Lisa's vocals are pushed further into the forefront and it works well. She has a great tone and she never goes for an operatic approach or over-sings. She lets her rich, beautiful voice do its job without forcing anything (listen to her haunting vocals on "Elysian Night"). She sometimes reminds of Marjan Welman (Autumn, Demiurg) and sometimes Anneke Van Giersbergen (The Gathering). Whenever she comes in, her voice captivates and it really meshes well with the death vocals (especially during "Deadlight" and "A Phantom Dissonance")."

- Hey "elite" are you going to troll this expert reviewer also?

Sad...

Written by Daniell on 30.06.2011 at 14:35

Except that they sound very much alike? I'd say it's a compliment to be compared to Sharon who, quality of her band aside, is a great singer without doubt.

I was *just* about to say this. Sharon's voice is very warm and sweet. =3

Written by Behdaad on 30.06.2011 at 14:12

Just give me a definition of 'fit'! Lol!

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fit

There you go, champ. I hope this helps.

I finally listened to it. I haven't heard much of Draconian's stuff, but I agree with Mr. Doctor on the growls and...I think it was Daniell who mentioned something about liking the album for just listening to two songs at once (I don't even want to go back and try and find out who said it because the entire debate was a little ridiculous). So, not bad. Not exceptional, either; I thoroughly enjoyed it. However, I can certainly see why Marcel might have some difficulties enjoying the album.

As for the entire discussion of elitism, I personally don't think any of the members who commented are elitists at all. They have listened to different bands, have different preferences in genres and know different amounts about the genres. We need to remember that everyone's just trying to satisfy their own tastes and desires and maybe some of the big names don't do it anymore for them. That's not elitism to me...it's rational self-interest. But hey, let's respect the opinions of others and respect them for the fact that they listened to the album and gave the musical group a chance to entertain them.

Written by Being and Time on 30.06.2011 at 19:02

As for the entire discussion of elitism, I personally don't think any of the members who commented are elitists at all. They have listened to different bands, have different preferences in genres and know different amounts about the genres. We need to remember that everyone's just trying to satisfy their own tastes and desires and maybe some of the big names don't do it anymore for them. That's not elitism to me...it's rational self-interest. But hey, let's respect the opinions of others and respect them for the fact that they listened to the album and gave the musical group a chance to entertain them.

good man

Written by Being and Time on 30.06.2011 at 19:02

Nice speech

Woa, only 13 posts here and I like you already.

@ being and time : ur post maybe the most rational one i saw long time ago here, instead of just accusing everyone who don't agree with u showed some understanding and reasoning. hope every one would do just the same.

Written by X-Ray Rod on 30.06.2011 at 19:27

Written by Being and Time on 30.06.2011 at 19:02

Nice speech

Woa, only 13 posts here and I like you already.

I know. I thought *I* made a new account and posted during my sleep or something. XD

I had an account on Metal Storm before, but I was arrogant, confrontational and whiny. Of course, that led to some Internet troubles because I inevitably pissed people off. So I was forced to consider my maturity level and made a new account, as Fat and Sassy! is getting at with his joke.

And finally, I would like to add that I recycle my newspapers. It's good to be environmentally friendly when you can.

^lulz

And yay for growing, maturing and other such things! ^~^

Y'all realize you are wasting time arguing with a guy who gave every draconian studio release a 10. so it's not as if he's rational.

everyone is entitled to an opinion regarding something as subjective as music, but anyone who gives anyone straight 10's or 1's is probably an opinion you can immediately disregard.

Hey "guy" feel free to check how many 1 or 10 I have on my ratings...

*g*

And still I am the arrogant...

Written by Vonpire on 30.06.2011 at 23:58

Hey "guy" feel free to check how many 1 or 10 I have on my ratings...

*g*

And still I am the arrogant...

He never said you handed out 1s. I think you need to read closer
What he did say was you handed out all 10s to Draconian's discography.I see you didn't give the demo's a 10. I am surprised

You know they love you dont ya hehehe

But your purpose was made. Congrats.


Giving 10 to Draconian is completely normal given the quality of the music. Sad u dont get it...

But, hey, your loss, no prob. Besides who calls them weak cant be a really serious person.

Written by Vonpire on 30.06.2011 at 23:58

Hey "guy" feel free to check how many 1 or 10 I have on my ratings...

*g*

And still I am the arrogant...

however you gave this band straight 10's... thus indicating quite clearly to me you are not remotely rational when discussing their music. i don't care about the rest of your ratings. this is a discussion on draconian and you seem clearly unable to view their works remotely objectively.

i didn't call you arrogant.

i am calling attention to your voting pattern with this act, and, thus someone whose opinion should be taken with a grain of salt when discussing the band. on second thought, a salt mine.

Written by Vonpire on 01.07.2011 at 00:16

You know they love you dont ya hehehe

But your purpose was made. Congrats.


Giving 10 to Draconian is completely normal given the quality of the music. Sad u dont get it...

But, hey, your loss, no prob. Besides who calls them weak cant be a really serious person.

10 means it's perfection, it's a metal landmark. And seeing you dissed out 72 10s on a total 0f about 600 releases and having an average of over 8 tells me you are very easily impressed.

I read the comments, and I don't want to be disrespectful cause I also have some issues with this album, but I believe Marcel you are a bit oldfashioned, because Lisa's vocal IMO are the best part of this album. Yes by some doom standards it would not fit, but who cares the standards ? Female vocal parts are written the best in this album. And it's not a songwriting, but arrangments I guess, that ruins the album a bit. However, after five or six listens I found that all of the songs are sounding in my head when I am not expecting this and I ended up by feeling listen to this album more and more, so I give a strong 9 to A Rose... cause I always loved "extremely accessible" sound of Draconian, cause "truly" first two albums was very accessible.

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.07.2011 at 00:20

Written by Vonpire on 01.07.2011 at 00:16

You know they love you dont ya hehehe

But your purpose was made. Congrats.


Giving 10 to Draconian is completely normal given the quality of the music. Sad u dont get it...

But, hey, your loss, no prob. Besides who calls them weak cant be a really serious person.

10 means it's perfection, it's a metal landmark. And seeing you dissed out 72 10s on a total 0f about 600 releases and having an average of over 8 tells me you are very easily impressed.

Haven't it crossed your mind, that some people doesn't rate albums they don't care about? O dislike? I listen to an album, I found it weak and I forget about it...

Written by annodomini on 01.07.2011 at 00:23

Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 01.07.2011 at 00:20

Written by Vonpire on 01.07.2011 at 00:16

You know they love you dont ya hehehe

But your purpose was made. Congrats.


Giving 10 to Draconian is completely normal given the quality of the music. Sad u dont get it...

But, hey, your loss, no prob. Besides who calls them weak cant be a really serious person.

10 means it's perfection, it's a metal landmark. And seeing you dissed out 72 10s on a total 0f about 600 releases and having an average of over 8 tells me you are very easily impressed.

Haven't it crossed your mind, that some people doesn't rate albums they don't care about? O dislike? I listen to an album, I found it weak and I forget about it...

he did rate albums he doesn't like look at his scores. But dissing out 72 10s I find a lot. Okay there are people awarding even more 10s and that is even more stupid tbh.

Oh, now people are doing "stupidity" for giving 10 to albums they consider perfect. You realise the huge amount of people youre offending at once dont you?

If only you talked of 1 vote abusers, I would agree. But we never agree, right ?


Damn, I dont want to discuss anymore.

Feel free to listen to my own made "Underground"
Http://myspace.com/djvonpire . I produced all of them. Dark but not metal.
And feel free to check my last fm page also.