Alex F
Posts: 3521 |
Wow. I'd say that's heavy praise for what essentially amounts to a mostly generic tech-death album. Definitely not my favorite genre, so I suspect those who do like the style will enjoy the album. Nice review though. Cool to see some new people on the front page consistently writing.
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Ilham Giant robot
Posts: 5161 |
08.12.2014 - 18:32Rating: 6
IlhamGiant robotPosts: 5161
I listened to that weirdly melodic song they released a couple months ago, and I was like "is this the JFAC I know?", but looks like it fits with what I read now. It intrigued me and I might just as well try the album.
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Written by Alex F on 08.12.2014 at 18:20
Wow. I'd say that's heavy praise for what essentially amounts to a mostly generic tech-death album. Definitely not my favorite genre, so I suspect those who do like the style will enjoy the album. Nice review though. Cool to see some new people on the front page consistently writing.
Pretty much my thoughts on it too. Its decent but its little more than a roller coaster where you go 'Ohhhh, ahhhh, look at this' but forget it all once the ride is done. Doesn't compel me to go back to it like the Cryptopsy or Cytotoxin sophomores
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Auntie Sahar Drone Empress
Posts: 5989 |
This is something I've noticed with some deathcore bands blurring the line between deathcore and tech death, and eventually gravitating more towards the latter. I prefer such a trend much more with The Faceless though, I haven't listened to this one yet, but I'd say Planetary Duality and Autotheist top recent JFAC by a considerable margin
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I am the Magician and the Exorcist. I am the axle of the wheel, and the cube in the circle. “Come unto me” is a foolish word: for it is I that go.
~ II. VII
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Uldreth
Posts: 1150
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Written by Auntie Sahar on 08.12.2014 at 19:22
This is something I've noticed with some deathcore bands blurring the line between deathcore and tech death, and eventually gravitating more towards the latter. I prefer such a trend much more with The Faceless though, I haven't listened to this one yet, but I'd say Planetary Duality and Autotheist top recent JFAC by a considerable margin
This is not really the case with JFAC though, since the only material they released that was deathcore was Doom, which was one EP (!!!) early on in their career (well, and their demo, but that is much more Dahlia-ish, imo). Contrast this to FOUR studio albums and one EP that were released after Doom, which weren't deathcore at all, just standard/tech DM with modern production and some occasional breakdowns, which is not a deathcore trait at all, since tons of pure DM bands also do breakdowns.
But hardcore/metalcore was almost completely absent from those releases, both musically and vocally, wheras Doom had tons of grind/deathgrind influences, as well as extensive use of stop-start dynamics and dissonant staccato riffing, as well as high-pitched screaming, which is a trait of early 2000s deathcore.
I find it quite weird that people are still making deathcore references to JFAC, since if we consider LPs to be twice the "measure" of EPs, then basically only 10% of their released materials are deathcore (discounting that demo), and none for 9 years.
What you say is true for The Faceless, Whitechapel (discounting the latest) and Carnifex for example, but I would not put JFAC there.
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Auntie Sahar Drone Empress
Posts: 5989 |
Written by Uldreth on 08.12.2014 at 20:07
This is not really the case with JFAC though, since the only material they released that was deathcore was Doom, which was one EP (!!!)
Oh damn, you're right, it was an EP, shit I thought it was a full length. Yeah, I remember a bunch of breakdowns and pig squeals on that one, but either way, if it's a relatively small amount of their discog then I suppose the deathcore label is a little unfounded now.
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I am the Magician and the Exorcist. I am the axle of the wheel, and the cube in the circle. “Come unto me” is a foolish word: for it is I that go.
~ II. VII
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-DC-002- Mastercommander
Posts: 1703 |
OOOK, ill have to check this out. I liked the Doom EP back in the day but then they ceased to do anything original. I wont expect anything world-shattering but hey.
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Coldgrits
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Susan Smeghead ElitePosts: 6941 |
SusanSmegheadElitePosts: 6941
Well this review intrigues the fuck out of me!!
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"A life all mine
Is what I choose
At the end of my days"
--The Gathering "A Life All Mine" from Souvenirs
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
09.12.2014 - 05:23Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Written by Alex F on 08.12.2014 at 18:20
Wow. I'd say that's heavy praise for what essentially amounts to a mostly generic tech-death album.
I'm not sure if you could call this tech death, it sounds more like death metal with some proggy and techy bits thrown in.
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HeavyWork
Posts: 31 |
09.12.2014 - 07:56Rating: 8
This album is fantastic. Creative songwriting, rememberable riffs, top notch musicianship.
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Auntie Sahar Drone Empress
Posts: 5989 |
Written by LeKiwi on 09.12.2014 at 05:23
I'm not sure if you could call this tech death, it sounds more like death metal with some proggy and techy bits thrown in.
....or, in other words, tech death
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I am the Magician and the Exorcist. I am the axle of the wheel, and the cube in the circle. “Come unto me” is a foolish word: for it is I that go.
~ II. VII
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 00:25Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Written by Auntie Sahar on 09.12.2014 at 23:55
....or, in other words, tech death
If you say so
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Auntie Sahar Drone Empress
Posts: 5989 |
Written by LeKiwi on 10.12.2014 at 00:25
If you say so
Well, I was just a bit confused, isn't "tech death" essentially indicative of death metal that's just super technical? I will admit that there is a difference between tech death and progressive death though.
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I am the Magician and the Exorcist. I am the axle of the wheel, and the cube in the circle. “Come unto me” is a foolish word: for it is I that go.
~ II. VII
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 09:25Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Written by Auntie Sahar on 10.12.2014 at 00:36
Well, I was just a bit confused, isn't "tech death" essentially indicative of death metal that's just super technical?
Pretty much, although I'd probably say that the technicality would have to come from speed, rather than complexity.
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Fallen Ghost Craft Beer Geek
Posts: 732 |
Have been listening to this a couple of times, was a little surprised actually when I heard "Sun of Nihility", it sounds very promising. But I feel that the album overall sounds a little "samey".
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Auntie Sahar Drone Empress
Posts: 5989 |
Written by LeKiwi on 10.12.2014 at 09:25
Pretty much, although I'd probably say that the technicality would have to come from speed, rather than complexity.
That's probably how most people would envision it, yes, but then something doesn't always have to be fast to be technical. Look at Meshuggah
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I am the Magician and the Exorcist. I am the axle of the wheel, and the cube in the circle. “Come unto me” is a foolish word: for it is I that go.
~ II. VII
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Anata were never that fast and they're undeniably tech death. Same with some Gorod stuff.
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Alex F
Posts: 3521 |
Written by LeKiwi on 10.12.2014 at 09:25
Pretty much, although I'd probably say that the technicality would have to come from speed, rather than complexity.
From a purely theoretical standpoint, technicality doesn't have to come from speed at all. Varying time signatures, vast tempo changes, and unconventional chord progressions can all create "technical" music, although it may not sound like most "tech death" bands. I think this album is definitely tech death, but from more of a "look at me play my guitar" standpoint than a "look at how much musical theory I can cram into each measure" one. I think the term "technical" can actually be subjective in some instances though, however it isn't an issue I've pondered very much.
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 16:42Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
These are some good points you three have made, but then where do you draw the line between technical and progressive/avant-garde/math?
I think they way you perceive technical is literal: difficult to play. I don't think that definition would prove useful in most cases given that the average listener has little knowledge of instrumental technicality.
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 16:58Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Personally, I wouldn't bother calling Meshuggah technical since math metal is inherently technical.
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Marcel Hubregtse Grumpy Old Fuck ElitePosts: 40071 |
Meshuggah are actually techno (tech) thrash. Only later were they renamed math or even djent.
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Member of the true crusade against European Flower Metal
Yesterday is dead and gone, tomorrow is out of sight
Dawn Crosby (r.i.p.)
05.04.1963 - 15.12.1996
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 17:01Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.12.2014 at 16:59
Meshuggah are actually techno (tech) thrash. Only later were they renamed math or even djent.
Later as in...?
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I don't recall them being called djent during Catch 33. I would probably say Obzen era.
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Marcel Hubregtse Grumpy Old Fuck ElitePosts: 40071 |
Written by LeKiwi on 10.12.2014 at 17:01
Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.12.2014 at 16:59
Meshuggah are actually techno (tech) thrash. Only later were they renamed math or even djent.
Later as in...?
djent from Obzen till now and math also around that same time. Math is mostly used for bands such as The Dillinger Escape Plan.
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Member of the true crusade against European Flower Metal
Yesterday is dead and gone, tomorrow is out of sight
Dawn Crosby (r.i.p.)
05.04.1963 - 15.12.1996
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 17:06Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Interesting...I still wouldn't call Meshuggah djent at any point. To me, they've always been math metal + progressive thrash since DEI.
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 17:08Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.12.2014 at 17:05
djent from Obzen till now and math also around that same time. Math is mostly used for bands such as The Dillinger Escape Plan.
Dillinger play mathcore, which is similar to math metal. Car Bomb play math metal and they sound quite a bit like Meshuggah.
Edit: everyone please excuse my off-topic posts.
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Uldreth
Posts: 1150
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Written by LeKiwi on 10.12.2014 at 17:08
Dillinger play mathcore, which is similar to math metal. Car Bomb play math metal and they sound quite a bit like Meshuggah.
Edit: everyone please excuse my off-topic posts.
Car Bomb is as mathcore as you can be.
Djent is also pretty much the same as "math metal" except djent also implies guitar tone, while "math metal" does not, though I'd say "math metal" is hardly a well defined thing (unlike djent, which, is, despite the hate the term gets, it is relatively well defined).
Mathcore, is different in the sense, it is built on erratic, rapidly shifting movements, unlike the relatively uniform, monotonous, and slowly changing structure of djent/later Meshuggah.
I do say though that on Chaosphere, Meshuggah was quite mathcore-ish tho, but still would not classify it as such.
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LeKiwi High Fist Prog
Posts: 4134 |
10.12.2014 - 21:45Rating: 8
LeKiwiHigh Fist ProgPosts: 4134
Written by Uldreth on 10.12.2014 at 19:33
Car Bomb is as mathcore as you can be.
Djent is also pretty much the same as "math metal" except djent also implies guitar tone, while "math metal" does not, though I'd say "math metal" is hardly a well defined thing (unlike djent, which, is, despite the hate the term gets, it is relatively well defined).
Mathcore, is different in the sense, it is built on erratic, rapidly shifting movements, unlike the relatively uniform, monotonous, and slowly changing structure of djent/later Meshuggah.
I do say though that on Chaosphere, Meshuggah was quite mathcore-ish tho, but still would not classify it as such.
You make a good point, I didn't pick a very good example. My point was, remove the core elements, lower the guitar tone, and you essentially have Meshuggah.
I would agree that there are some strong similarities between math metal and djent, but that's far from saying that the only difference is guitar tone. Math metal is far more erratic and utilises guitar chords - often those of dissonant nature - as often as staccato notes. Djent, on the the other hand - other than specifying a guitar tone - also implies that a majority of the guitar work is centred around single staccato notes and, as you say, has more structure with respect to the songwriting.
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Written by Marcel Hubregtse on 10.12.2014 at 16:59
techno (tech) thrash.
That's a new way of hearing it for me.
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